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listening to fade to black with your

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host jimmy church on the dark matter

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radio network

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don't run and hide

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don't be afraid

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don't turn away any longer

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the truth will set you free

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and now your host the captain of

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conspiracy the prince of paranormal

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this ain't your daddy's radio network

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show

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alright here we go

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friday

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fade to black

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all right

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settled in

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lights are off

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and it's april 11th 99 days into the new

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as always we are live from the jp

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motorsports studios right here in sunny

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hot

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for kjcr and the dark matter radio

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network i am your host jimmy church

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welcome to everyone listening around the

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world

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start off the show the same way every

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night

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with a big salute to the proud men and

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women in uniform

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all around the world fighting the good

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fight for us

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without them there is no me there is no

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you there is no us and you couldn't hear

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me right now

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and i do mean it

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all right

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actor

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director

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vincent gallo

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53 years old today

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and by far

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by a long ways

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we were

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talking

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a couple of months ago one of the

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production meetings here

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at uh fade to black

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we wanted to do a parody so you know

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what i'm letting

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the staff here know

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because they're listening

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we got to get that parody done and the

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parody is this

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vincent gallo in buffalo 66 is one of

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the best scenes in cinema it's a great

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movie by the way and if you haven't seen

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it you need to check it out it is

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unbelievably great

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he does the scene where he is

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kidnapping

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uh i think it's christina richie

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kidnapping her and

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and

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he's in a car

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and he says she's got a stick shift

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and he can't drive a stick shift and he

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says this line i am use

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to luxury cars

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cars that shift

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themselves

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now what does that have to do with fade

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to black

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well

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the parody is

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i want to show

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all right all right

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uh host of top gear jeremy clarkson and

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if you don't watch that show you should

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because it is fantastic jeremy clarkson

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you know i am an anglophile jane uh

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jeremy

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and check this out

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oliver rydell

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bassist for the band ramstein

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43 years old

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love ramstein

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and again

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those birthdays are clues to my dark

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twisted mind

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if you start putting all of the stuff

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together eventually you'll figure me out

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love ramstein follow us on twitter at

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jchurchradio

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twitter is active tonight it's open it

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is in front of me

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you want to get to me directly during

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the show do it through twitter if you

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want to bypass the producers

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email me jimmy jimmychurchradio.com you

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know what to do

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those go to the producers first before

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jimmy jimmychurchradio.com tonight we're

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gonna have open lines

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three two three eight two five fifty

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forty five our guest tonight is annie

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jacobson

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and uh she's got two books out two

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fabulous books area 51 and operation

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paperclip i was talking to annie before

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the show tonight and she said i want to

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take some calls so

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you want to talk to annie two

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controversial books

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and a new tv series uh three two three

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eight two five fifty forty five

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the first half of the interview oh you

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know what we'll talk about that in a

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little bit uh but anyway email jimmy

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jimmychurchradio.com

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and uh that's about it for now let me

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think

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uh

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what else do we have going on oh oh oh

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oh oh oh

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we have the link

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to the youtube video

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up on

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jimmychurchradio.com for nancy talbot

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and i watched it today

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and so go to jimmychurchradio.com scroll

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down on the front page

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and the link is there and what it is for

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her new crop circle uh stuff that's

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going on down and

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that's going down now in holland

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is an aerial view

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uh i don't know how they took the shot

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it must have been well it's got to be a

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helicopter i guess

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uh but check it out it's pretty cool and

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nancy says

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that robert says

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robert van der brook

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that if you watch the video

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you will have a moment of clarity

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it will it'll it's going to jump through

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the ionosphere

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and get to you

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now check it out i did it today

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and i think

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i got there

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so check out the video it's pretty cool

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jimmychurchradio.com scroll down it's

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above the galleries it's on the right

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side it doesn't have its own spot

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it's uh

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below the advertisements you can find it

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and it says right there crop circle

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consciousness and uh if you know where

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that came from

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that was uh caddyshack okay

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all right

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uh let's get the show going we've got a

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lot to cover tonight

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i would uh encourage everybody

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to go and look at the galleries that we

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have posted for annie so you can do that

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in advance

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but we will be discussing tonight her

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new series

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chris carter x-files

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the series is going to be called area 51

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on amc

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they are shooting it now and we're also

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going to talk about her new book

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operation paperclip

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so with that don't touch that mouse get

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twitter going

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at j church radio get the emails going

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and we will open up the phone lines

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three two three eight two five fifty

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forty five i'm your host jimmy church

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this is fade to black i'll be back right

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you're listening to jimmy church fade to

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what's up revolutionaries it's me jimmy

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church

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do you have an irs or state tax issue

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well i did and i called national tax

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experts

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my problems were fixed done fini and man

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i gotta tell you it was a relief

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national tax experts are recognized tax

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office that services clients in all 50

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states it doesn't matter where you live

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give them a call i'm telling you they

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take the time to understand each and

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every client's individual financial

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status as well as their financial goals

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and that's exactly what you need my

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brother when you're taking on the evil 3

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letter so seriously give them a call

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again

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seven nine 1-877-999 nine five four four

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four or go check out their website dub

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dub dub nat tax experts dot com that's

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n-a-t-t-a-x

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dot com tell him jimmy sent you

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yeah yeah yeah

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all right fade to black

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kjcr

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on the dark matter radio network

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i'm your host jimmy church now

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check this out

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next week

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what do i do

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it's 10 o'clock 10 30 get home eat of

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what do i do

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well

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to the behest of my wife one of my

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favorite things to do is i

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scan the web

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for really cool offbeat radio shows and

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podcasts

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and

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to

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get

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ah

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shows about

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uh

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and i want to say this correctly to

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everybody so you understand the frame of

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mind

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i like to find

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the shows about

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uh

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debunking skeptics

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and and i scour the web and i listen to

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those things all night long

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because usually they're

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talking about

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people

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and subjects that probably won't be on

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this show

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and i'm not going to get into specific

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names because that doesn't really matter

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but what matters is the subjects

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and i'm really into it and some of these

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guys spend a lot of time

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on subjects that you know what it saves

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me time

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because i can listen i can take notes

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and

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next week i'm going to set up a bunch of

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we're working on it now we're getting

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close i've reached out to

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uh probably a half a dozen of the of the

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main guys out there

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and

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so next week

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we're gonna have uh

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we're gonna touch all those subjects

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that are really really really fringe

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and

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i am talking about

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objects on the moon objects on mars

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uh nibiru

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planet x

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anunnaki sichen

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the fringe stuff i can go on and on and

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on and on that's just what's on the

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front of my brain right now

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but all of those subjects that for me

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i don't buy into

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and there's a whole lot of guys out

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there that don't buy into it either

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and in some of these

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subjects i'm on both sides of the fence

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i'm on both sides

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i want to believe there's some stuff

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there that is factual that

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that suck me in

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and then there's the other side where

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i'm just like no come on

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come on

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so that's what's good i think it's going

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to be a great week of radio next week

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and and i'm excited about it so we'll

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unveil everything as we roll into you

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know how we do it here

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it'll be tuesday tuesday evening when we

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00:13:21,350 --> 00:13:18,839
reveal next week's guest list and

292
00:13:23,829 --> 00:13:21,360
schedule and we do that for one reason

293
00:13:25,590 --> 00:13:23,839
and one reason only poaching

294
00:13:27,590 --> 00:13:25,600
really gets on my nerves

295
00:13:29,430 --> 00:13:27,600
but uh so

296
00:13:31,910 --> 00:13:29,440
i reveal everything at the last minute

297
00:13:34,949 --> 00:13:31,920
so nobody else can book those guests and

298
00:13:35,829 --> 00:13:34,959
know how we think and how we're thinking

299
00:13:37,829 --> 00:13:35,839
here

300
00:13:38,710 --> 00:13:37,839
so that's going to be next week and i'm

301
00:13:43,829 --> 00:13:38,720
really

302
00:13:47,110 --> 00:13:43,839
i want to learn

303
00:13:49,590 --> 00:13:47,120
but i also i think confrontation

304
00:13:52,230 --> 00:13:49,600
is also a good thing

305
00:13:54,150 --> 00:13:52,240
i i want to be challenged and i want to

306
00:13:56,389 --> 00:13:54,160
challenge there's no reason to throw

307
00:13:58,629 --> 00:13:56,399
softballs on this show there's it's not

308
00:14:00,949 --> 00:13:58,639
even fun if you do that

309
00:14:02,870 --> 00:14:00,959
i want to learn and i think that's

310
00:14:06,150 --> 00:14:02,880
what's going to go down next week okay

311
00:14:09,829 --> 00:14:06,160
so let's uh let's move forward

312
00:14:11,670 --> 00:14:09,839
got to talk about mh 370. what have we

313
00:14:13,670 --> 00:14:11,680
learned today what did we learn in the

314
00:14:14,550 --> 00:14:13,680
last 24 hours

315
00:14:16,470 --> 00:14:14,560
well

316
00:14:18,949 --> 00:14:16,480
what we have learned in the last 24

317
00:14:22,870 --> 00:14:18,959
hours is well first off same as

318
00:14:30,790 --> 00:14:24,310
the

319
00:14:31,829 --> 00:14:30,800
is breaking on it

320
00:14:34,069 --> 00:14:31,839
is

321
00:14:36,629 --> 00:14:34,079
i cannot believe now that we are in week

322
00:14:41,030 --> 00:14:36,639
number five

323
00:14:42,629 --> 00:14:41,040
we are 35 days into this 35

324
00:14:44,470 --> 00:14:42,639
and we have nothing

325
00:14:45,590 --> 00:14:44,480
not one

326
00:14:47,829 --> 00:14:45,600
piece

327
00:14:48,790 --> 00:14:47,839
of anything from that plane has been

328
00:14:49,829 --> 00:14:48,800
found

329
00:14:51,750 --> 00:14:49,839
so

330
00:14:53,990 --> 00:14:51,760
now

331
00:14:55,910 --> 00:14:54,000
this is how i picture

332
00:14:57,910 --> 00:14:55,920
the only way that that is possible well

333
00:15:00,949 --> 00:14:57,920
there's two there's two ways that that

334
00:15:03,670 --> 00:15:00,959
is possible but the only way

335
00:15:06,230 --> 00:15:03,680
one of two ways that that is possible is

336
00:15:08,230 --> 00:15:06,240
a nice soft

337
00:15:10,389 --> 00:15:08,240
belly landing

338
00:15:12,710 --> 00:15:10,399
just cruise that thing right on top of

339
00:15:13,750 --> 00:15:12,720
the water just kiss the water like you

340
00:15:17,670 --> 00:15:13,760
would

341
00:15:20,550 --> 00:15:17,680
nice and light

342
00:15:23,990 --> 00:15:20,560
run that thing in and then it just sinks

343
00:15:26,790 --> 00:15:24,000
doesn't break apart that's one thought

344
00:15:29,509 --> 00:15:26,800
makes sense doesn't it that's one

345
00:15:32,710 --> 00:15:29,519
and the other one is that plane

346
00:15:36,230 --> 00:15:34,550
if it was shot out of the sky and

347
00:15:38,310 --> 00:15:36,240
exploded if there's something

348
00:15:40,310 --> 00:15:38,320
catastrophic on board

349
00:15:41,910 --> 00:15:40,320
those lithium-ion batteries that they

350
00:15:43,829 --> 00:15:41,920
were carrying that's another thing you

351
00:15:46,230 --> 00:15:43,839
know possibly

352
00:15:48,470 --> 00:15:46,240
you know some kind of fire

353
00:15:52,069 --> 00:15:48,480
he'd have a debris field

354
00:15:54,150 --> 00:15:52,079
he'd have all kinds of stuff floating

355
00:15:55,910 --> 00:15:54,160
and there are plenty of things on that

356
00:15:57,990 --> 00:15:55,920
plane that aren't made out of metal and

357
00:16:00,389 --> 00:15:58,000
aluminum that sink

358
00:16:02,389 --> 00:16:00,399
that would just float forever and and

359
00:16:04,550 --> 00:16:02,399
after five weeks don't you think washing

360
00:16:07,990 --> 00:16:04,560
up on a beach somewhere

361
00:16:13,910 --> 00:16:10,069
it's confusing to me

362
00:16:16,629 --> 00:16:13,920
and i received so much email

363
00:16:20,069 --> 00:16:16,639
over the last two weeks

364
00:16:22,470 --> 00:16:20,079
and especially over the last week

365
00:16:24,310 --> 00:16:22,480
about my mind going to the dark side and

366
00:16:27,670 --> 00:16:24,320
you know what i'm glad you guys listen

367
00:16:29,749 --> 00:16:27,680
like you do and pay attention because

368
00:16:31,670 --> 00:16:29,759
we all think alike

369
00:16:33,350 --> 00:16:31,680
and the longer that this goes on the

370
00:16:35,189 --> 00:16:33,360
darker that it gets

371
00:16:36,470 --> 00:16:35,199
it's the truth

372
00:16:39,829 --> 00:16:36,480
so

373
00:16:43,189 --> 00:16:39,839
the the dark side where

374
00:16:45,030 --> 00:16:43,199
where am i going where are you going

375
00:16:47,590 --> 00:16:45,040
with your thoughts

376
00:16:50,389 --> 00:16:47,600
tonight after annie jacobson

377
00:16:51,990 --> 00:16:50,399
i'm going to be taking phone calls and i

378
00:16:53,749 --> 00:16:52,000
want to know

379
00:16:56,150 --> 00:16:53,759
so tonight's your opportunity i want to

380
00:16:59,509 --> 00:16:56,160
hear everybody's theories

381
00:17:01,269 --> 00:16:59,519
on mh370 i have a bunch of stuff

382
00:17:02,310 --> 00:17:01,279
compiled here

383
00:17:03,670 --> 00:17:02,320
uh

384
00:17:06,630 --> 00:17:03,680
none of it good

385
00:17:08,710 --> 00:17:06,640
but all of it as time goes by is about

386
00:17:11,350 --> 00:17:08,720
is valid

387
00:17:12,390 --> 00:17:11,360
so what have we learned today check the

388
00:17:16,150 --> 00:17:12,400
these are

389
00:17:20,870 --> 00:17:18,710
quote we have very much narrowed down

390
00:17:23,189 --> 00:17:20,880
the search area and we are very

391
00:17:24,710 --> 00:17:23,199
confident that the signals that we are

392
00:17:27,590 --> 00:17:24,720
detecting

393
00:17:29,430 --> 00:17:27,600
are from the black box on mh370 end

394
00:17:31,110 --> 00:17:29,440
quote that is from australian prime

395
00:17:33,430 --> 00:17:31,120
minister tony abbott

396
00:17:37,510 --> 00:17:33,440
as he told reporters today

397
00:17:39,430 --> 00:17:37,520
on his official visit to china

398
00:17:41,029 --> 00:17:39,440
now what do you deduce from that what do

399
00:17:43,270 --> 00:17:41,039
you what do you draw out of that what do

400
00:17:46,630 --> 00:17:43,280
you get out of that

401
00:17:48,390 --> 00:17:46,640
well first off he says we have very much

402
00:17:49,909 --> 00:17:48,400
narrowed

403
00:17:54,150 --> 00:17:49,919
but i don't even know what that means

404
00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:59,270
it's nothing it says nothing

405
00:18:03,510 --> 00:18:01,029
they haven't found any they don't they

406
00:18:04,630 --> 00:18:03,520
don't know now what i am shocked about

407
00:18:07,350 --> 00:18:04,640
is

408
00:18:12,230 --> 00:18:07,360
how they have suddenly just gotten right

409
00:18:18,150 --> 00:18:15,909
from something from the ping pingers

410
00:18:20,470 --> 00:18:18,160
so they knew something to get to that

411
00:18:22,789 --> 00:18:20,480
search area so quickly and just right on

412
00:18:25,590 --> 00:18:22,799
top of and found

413
00:18:26,789 --> 00:18:25,600
i don't know how but nobody's talking

414
00:18:28,710 --> 00:18:26,799
and

415
00:18:31,909 --> 00:18:28,720
but yet everybody is talking behind the

416
00:18:38,470 --> 00:18:35,590
the fifth ping detected by sono buoy

417
00:18:40,830 --> 00:18:38,480
dropped by an airplane is unlikely to be

418
00:18:43,750 --> 00:18:40,840
related to the aircraft black

419
00:18:47,909 --> 00:18:43,760
boxes retired chief marshal angus

420
00:18:52,150 --> 00:18:49,350
what did i just say with the prime

421
00:18:55,830 --> 00:18:52,160
minister i i i

422
00:18:57,830 --> 00:18:55,840
i'm fascinated with this

423
00:19:00,230 --> 00:18:57,840
either it's a ping or it's not and what

424
00:19:04,789 --> 00:19:00,240
are they doing finding uh the this fifth

425
00:19:09,669 --> 00:19:07,270
i don't get it the beacons are certified

426
00:19:12,630 --> 00:19:09,679
to last 30 days but will probably last

427
00:19:15,830 --> 00:19:12,640
at least 35 which could be saturday that

428
00:19:18,789 --> 00:19:15,840
is tomorrow according to chris portal

429
00:19:21,029 --> 00:19:18,799
director of duquesne cecom the

430
00:19:23,270 --> 00:19:21,039
manufacturer of the pingers

431
00:19:24,470 --> 00:19:23,280
so is tomorrow the drop dead day is that

432
00:19:27,190 --> 00:19:24,480
it

433
00:19:28,549 --> 00:19:27,200
we wasted so much time in the south

434
00:19:32,150 --> 00:19:28,559
china sea

435
00:19:34,070 --> 00:19:32,160
three to six days of just wasted time

436
00:19:36,710 --> 00:19:34,080
that we can't get back and now we are

437
00:19:38,710 --> 00:19:36,720
sitting here 35 days

438
00:19:40,310 --> 00:19:38,720
when they knew

439
00:19:43,270 --> 00:19:40,320
not only the malaysians but you know

440
00:19:45,669 --> 00:19:43,280
that the united states knew

441
00:19:47,669 --> 00:19:45,679
that that plane didn't go east it went

442
00:19:50,230 --> 00:19:47,679
west

443
00:19:52,390 --> 00:19:50,240
and now we're out of time

444
00:19:53,830 --> 00:19:52,400
and this is the thing

445
00:19:56,870 --> 00:19:53,840
the reason why i read this to you in

446
00:20:03,750 --> 00:19:59,590
it just seems to me

447
00:20:08,950 --> 00:20:06,150
because once they go the search is just

448
00:20:13,990 --> 00:20:08,960
going to go on forever

449
00:20:18,870 --> 00:20:15,830
the boeing jetliner disappeared from

450
00:20:21,350 --> 00:20:18,880
military radar for about 120

451
00:20:23,029 --> 00:20:21,360
nautical miles after it after it had

452
00:20:25,029 --> 00:20:23,039
crossed back over the malaysian

453
00:20:26,549 --> 00:20:25,039
peninsula

454
00:20:28,470 --> 00:20:26,559
this means that the plane must have

455
00:20:31,830 --> 00:20:28,480
dropped to an altitude of four thousand

456
00:20:35,990 --> 00:20:34,549
now if they know this and they knew this

457
00:20:37,830 --> 00:20:36,000
then

458
00:20:39,669 --> 00:20:37,840
they knew it dropped off the radar when

459
00:20:41,350 --> 00:20:39,679
it was coming back over malaysia they

460
00:20:44,630 --> 00:20:41,360
knew this that's why they were searching

461
00:20:50,870 --> 00:20:46,230
and if it dropped to four to five

462
00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:54,630
tactical maneuver

463
00:20:54,640 --> 00:21:01,350
why waste all of that time

464
00:21:04,789 --> 00:21:02,390
unless

465
00:21:07,510 --> 00:21:04,799
they wanted to push things back

466
00:21:08,789 --> 00:21:07,520
and here we are sitting at day 35 we

467
00:21:11,190 --> 00:21:08,799
know nothing

468
00:21:12,710 --> 00:21:11,200
we know that the batteries are about to

469
00:21:15,669 --> 00:21:12,720
run out they're not going to last

470
00:21:19,510 --> 00:21:17,190
and we don't have anything official

471
00:21:22,310 --> 00:21:19,520
today do we

472
00:21:23,430 --> 00:21:22,320
it's amazing it's just amazing it's

473
00:21:26,390 --> 00:21:23,440
stunning

474
00:21:29,190 --> 00:21:26,400
i've got a lot more than this that i'm

475
00:21:31,990 --> 00:21:29,200
going to be going over tonight

476
00:21:34,470 --> 00:21:32,000
after annie jacobson and i i want to

477
00:21:37,270 --> 00:21:34,480
hear from you i want to know

478
00:21:39,350 --> 00:21:37,280
is it just me

479
00:21:40,470 --> 00:21:39,360
all right let's get to fun stuff the

480
00:21:43,990 --> 00:21:40,480
tetrad

481
00:21:47,830 --> 00:21:44,000
kicks off this tuesday

482
00:21:49,990 --> 00:21:47,840
prophecy love signs from the heavens

483
00:21:52,630 --> 00:21:50,000
they're gonna deliver

484
00:21:54,789 --> 00:21:52,640
with a moonlight spectacle this tuesday

485
00:21:57,669 --> 00:21:54,799
i cannot wait

486
00:21:59,350 --> 00:21:57,679
right after the show get to run outside

487
00:22:03,990 --> 00:21:59,360
look to the heavens

488
00:22:09,029 --> 00:22:06,710
the moon will turn to blood as it aligns

489
00:22:10,950 --> 00:22:09,039
with earth and sun

490
00:22:14,710 --> 00:22:10,960
then do so thrice

491
00:22:17,990 --> 00:22:14,720
more air a year and half is done

492
00:22:21,350 --> 00:22:18,000
tis not the herald of the apocalypses

493
00:22:23,430 --> 00:22:21,360
just the first of four total lunar

494
00:22:24,950 --> 00:22:23,440
eclipses

495
00:22:26,870 --> 00:22:24,960
you like that

496
00:22:30,390 --> 00:22:26,880
in other words get ready for an

497
00:22:32,950 --> 00:22:30,400
unusually beautiful moon

498
00:22:35,110 --> 00:22:32,960
it's going to be out there next week

499
00:22:37,669 --> 00:22:35,120
there will be a total

500
00:22:40,789 --> 00:22:37,679
of four

501
00:22:43,590 --> 00:22:40,799
the blood moon now check this out

502
00:22:46,549 --> 00:22:43,600
roughly six month intervals

503
00:22:51,510 --> 00:22:46,559
the following dates april 15 2014

504
00:22:53,510 --> 00:22:51,520
october 8th 2014 april 4th 2015

505
00:22:55,190 --> 00:22:53,520
and september 28

506
00:22:57,510 --> 00:22:55,200
2015.

507
00:22:59,750 --> 00:22:57,520
and that is really cool and it's one of

508
00:23:01,750 --> 00:22:59,760
those things i have the feeling i hope

509
00:23:02,950 --> 00:23:01,760
it's not a big letdown i hope we walk

510
00:23:04,470 --> 00:23:02,960
outside

511
00:23:06,549 --> 00:23:04,480
look up

512
00:23:08,789 --> 00:23:06,559
and it's not silver it's it's orange

513
00:23:11,350 --> 00:23:08,799
it's red

514
00:23:12,950 --> 00:23:11,360
and we get to experience that in our

515
00:23:13,909 --> 00:23:12,960
lifetime and i think it's going to be

516
00:23:15,909 --> 00:23:13,919
something

517
00:23:18,390 --> 00:23:15,919
that you'll remember forever i really

518
00:23:22,950 --> 00:23:20,549
we're all talking about it next week see

519
00:23:25,750 --> 00:23:22,960
it happens on tuesday show's

520
00:23:27,750 --> 00:23:25,760
next show is next wednesday

521
00:23:29,110 --> 00:23:27,760
and i hope it changes me

522
00:23:32,470 --> 00:23:29,120
i really do

523
00:23:36,310 --> 00:23:32,480
do you know what an upart is

524
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,990
o-o-p-a-r-t

525
00:23:43,190 --> 00:23:41,669
an oop art

526
00:23:46,950 --> 00:23:43,200
o part

527
00:23:48,230 --> 00:23:46,960
is an out of place artifact

528
00:23:51,029 --> 00:23:48,240
talked about it

529
00:23:51,990 --> 00:23:51,039
a lot on this show

530
00:23:54,149 --> 00:23:52,000
and

531
00:23:55,750 --> 00:23:54,159
the

532
00:23:57,830 --> 00:23:55,760
uh parts are

533
00:24:00,549 --> 00:23:57,840
things like and if you remember when we

534
00:24:04,070 --> 00:24:00,559
had michael cremo on an upart is

535
00:24:06,070 --> 00:24:04,080
something that just shouldn't be there

536
00:24:08,750 --> 00:24:06,080
in other words maybe a nut or a bolt

537
00:24:14,149 --> 00:24:08,760
that's sitting inside of

538
00:24:18,870 --> 00:24:17,110
an ibm computer is found in the base of

539
00:24:23,269 --> 00:24:18,880
a pyramid that's

540
00:24:30,950 --> 00:24:25,750
they

541
00:24:32,390 --> 00:24:30,960
it seems

542
00:24:34,950 --> 00:24:32,400
that

543
00:24:36,470 --> 00:24:34,960
the orthodoxy

544
00:24:39,990 --> 00:24:36,480
of

545
00:24:42,710 --> 00:24:40,000
when it comes to

546
00:24:44,789 --> 00:24:42,720
artifacts like that that that entire

547
00:24:47,029 --> 00:24:44,799
side will poopoo on it you never hear

548
00:24:48,390 --> 00:24:47,039
about it never breaks into mainstream

549
00:24:49,430 --> 00:24:48,400
news

550
00:24:53,029 --> 00:24:49,440
but

551
00:24:54,710 --> 00:24:53,039
a hammer was found in london texas

552
00:24:56,870 --> 00:24:54,720
in 1934

553
00:24:58,789 --> 00:24:56,880
it was encased in stone

554
00:25:03,110 --> 00:24:58,799
that had formed around it

555
00:25:07,669 --> 00:25:06,310
the rock surrounding the hammer is said

556
00:25:14,230 --> 00:25:07,679
to be

557
00:25:18,950 --> 00:25:16,070
how is that possible you should see the

558
00:25:21,110 --> 00:25:18,960
pictures of this thing

559
00:25:23,430 --> 00:25:21,120
carl bow who is in possession of the

560
00:25:26,149 --> 00:25:23,440
artifact announced that it was tested by

561
00:25:28,870 --> 00:25:26,159
battelle laboratory in columbus ohio the

562
00:25:30,630 --> 00:25:28,880
same lab that tested the nasa moon rocks

563
00:25:31,990 --> 00:25:30,640
and before you say anything

564
00:25:35,269 --> 00:25:32,000
yes the same

565
00:25:37,190 --> 00:25:35,279
the tests were found that the hammer

566
00:25:38,950 --> 00:25:37,200
or the rock around the ham or the hammer

567
00:25:41,269 --> 00:25:38,960
itself before i jump into that had a

568
00:25:42,390 --> 00:25:41,279
metallurgy of 96.6

569
00:25:46,029 --> 00:25:42,400
iron

570
00:25:51,990 --> 00:25:46,039
2.6 percent chlorine

571
00:25:55,669 --> 00:25:53,990
it's absolutely nuts

572
00:25:58,630 --> 00:25:55,679
i think we've got the link up to the

573
00:26:01,029 --> 00:25:58,640
story uh on the website

574
00:26:02,710 --> 00:26:01,039
but i dig this kind of stuff

575
00:26:04,390 --> 00:26:02,720
and there's so much of it around the

576
00:26:06,710 --> 00:26:04,400
world before you bring up that

577
00:26:10,950 --> 00:26:06,720
antikythera mechanism okay well that's

578
00:26:13,029 --> 00:26:10,960
sort of one but that was an invention um

579
00:26:15,269 --> 00:26:13,039
and we've since figured that out but

580
00:26:19,190 --> 00:26:15,279
what i'm referring to is

581
00:26:24,789 --> 00:26:22,070
encased in rock that just shouldn't be

582
00:26:27,110 --> 00:26:24,799
there 100 million years old 200 million

583
00:26:28,950 --> 00:26:27,120
years old 300 million years old and this

584
00:26:30,789 --> 00:26:28,960
rock or this hammer

585
00:26:34,070 --> 00:26:30,799
is an example of that

586
00:26:36,149 --> 00:26:34,080
absolutely cool i said last night before

587
00:26:38,149 --> 00:26:36,159
we get to the break here

588
00:26:39,990 --> 00:26:38,159
about the show on covering aliens got a

589
00:26:42,789 --> 00:26:40,000
bunch of email about that and michael

590
00:26:46,230 --> 00:26:42,799
barra look

591
00:26:49,029 --> 00:26:46,240
i'm not endorsing michael barra

592
00:26:52,470 --> 00:26:49,039
i i just don't go there michael does his

593
00:26:54,789 --> 00:26:52,480
own thing he's good in the show though

594
00:26:55,750 --> 00:26:54,799
the show was pretty good and that's what

595
00:26:57,990 --> 00:26:55,760
i mean

596
00:26:59,190 --> 00:26:58,000
go and check out the show

597
00:27:02,950 --> 00:26:59,200
it's like

598
00:27:07,430 --> 00:27:05,510
and i do mean it

599
00:27:10,230 --> 00:27:07,440
it's a pretty good show check it out all

600
00:27:11,909 --> 00:27:10,240
right let's get to uh let's get to the

601
00:27:16,470 --> 00:27:11,919
next break

602
00:27:17,750 --> 00:27:16,480
let's get to annie jacobson and uh again

603
00:27:18,830 --> 00:27:17,760
for two bucks

604
00:27:20,549 --> 00:27:18,840
area

605
00:27:24,230 --> 00:27:20,559
51.

606
00:27:27,430 --> 00:27:25,750
shoot us an email right now to jimmy

607
00:27:30,710 --> 00:27:27,440
jimmychurchradio.com

608
00:27:31,909 --> 00:27:30,720
i see that the tweets are coming in

609
00:27:33,430 --> 00:27:31,919
i'll be back

610
00:27:44,710 --> 00:27:33,440
right after this don't touch that mouth

611
00:27:49,830 --> 00:27:47,110
way out here we listen to jimmy church

612
00:27:55,110 --> 00:27:49,840
on the dark matter radio network

613
00:28:11,830 --> 00:27:57,590
you're listening to fade to black on the

614
00:28:16,470 --> 00:28:14,230
you're listening to jimmy church this is

615
00:28:19,510 --> 00:28:16,480
revolution the revolution

616
00:28:21,590 --> 00:28:19,520
will not be televised the revolution is

617
00:29:03,909 --> 00:28:21,600
on radio

618
00:29:08,149 --> 00:29:05,669
all right everybody welcome back fade to

619
00:29:09,909 --> 00:29:08,159
black kjcr

620
00:29:11,909 --> 00:29:09,919
on the dark matter radio network i'm

621
00:29:13,750 --> 00:29:11,919
your host jimmy church shoot us an email

622
00:29:16,070 --> 00:29:13,760
to jimmy timmychurchradio.com you got

623
00:29:17,990 --> 00:29:16,080
anything for annie

624
00:29:22,710 --> 00:29:18,000
pierce the veil of the producers get it

625
00:29:24,950 --> 00:29:22,720
to me twitter is open at j church radio

626
00:29:27,110 --> 00:29:24,960
annie jacobson is an investigative

627
00:29:29,029 --> 00:29:27,120
journalist and author who writes about

628
00:29:31,269 --> 00:29:29,039
war weapons

629
00:29:33,269 --> 00:29:31,279
the u.s national security and government

630
00:29:35,350 --> 00:29:33,279
secrecy her newest book operation

631
00:29:37,269 --> 00:29:35,360
paperclip the secret intelligence

632
00:29:38,310 --> 00:29:37,279
program that brought nazi scientists to

633
00:29:40,630 --> 00:29:38,320
america

634
00:29:43,350 --> 00:29:40,640
was published in february

635
00:29:46,070 --> 00:29:43,360
2014 and has become an instant new york

636
00:29:49,350 --> 00:29:46,080
times bestseller her 2011 non-fiction

637
00:29:51,669 --> 00:29:49,360
bestseller area 51 an uncensored history

638
00:29:53,830 --> 00:29:51,679
of america's top secret military base

639
00:29:55,990 --> 00:29:53,840
has been published in five languages and

640
00:29:58,710 --> 00:29:56,000
is being made into an amc scripted

641
00:30:01,029 --> 00:29:58,720
television series with gail ann heard

642
00:30:02,549 --> 00:30:01,039
from walking dead and terminator and

643
00:30:04,470 --> 00:30:02,559
chris carter

644
00:30:06,470 --> 00:30:04,480
from the x-files i would like to welcome

645
00:30:08,710 --> 00:30:06,480
to the program right now

646
00:30:09,990 --> 00:30:08,720
annie jacobson welcome to fade to black

647
00:30:11,750 --> 00:30:10,000
annie

648
00:30:13,029 --> 00:30:11,760
thank you so much for having me it's a

649
00:30:15,350 --> 00:30:13,039
real pleasure

650
00:30:18,950 --> 00:30:15,360
thank you thank you very much now before

651
00:30:20,389 --> 00:30:18,960
we uh get serious uh i do the same thing

652
00:30:22,870 --> 00:30:20,399
with every guest

653
00:30:24,630 --> 00:30:22,880
and which is this is just a long-form

654
00:30:25,830 --> 00:30:24,640
conversation you and i are sitting in my

655
00:30:27,430 --> 00:30:25,840
living room

656
00:30:30,230 --> 00:30:27,440
and we're just gonna talk there's

657
00:30:33,029 --> 00:30:30,240
nothing scripted no questions

658
00:30:35,430 --> 00:30:33,039
no notes and hopefully by the end uh

659
00:30:36,630 --> 00:30:35,440
we're still friends

660
00:30:39,110 --> 00:30:36,640
okay

661
00:30:40,710 --> 00:30:39,120
um uh the you know

662
00:30:42,950 --> 00:30:40,720
uh we were talking before the show about

663
00:30:45,990 --> 00:30:42,960
a couple of things and

664
00:30:49,269 --> 00:30:46,000
um i don't throw softballs but usually

665
00:30:51,830 --> 00:30:49,279
the first question is is soft ball-ish

666
00:30:53,510 --> 00:30:51,840
and for you it's it's like you know the

667
00:30:56,310 --> 00:30:53,520
pink elephant in the room so i just have

668
00:30:58,549 --> 00:30:56,320
to go there first which is

669
00:31:03,110 --> 00:30:58,559
you're you're in a man's world you write

670
00:31:05,269 --> 00:31:03,120
about war area 51 operation paperclip

671
00:31:06,310 --> 00:31:05,279
uh the third reich

672
00:31:08,950 --> 00:31:06,320
uh

673
00:31:12,149 --> 00:31:08,960
is is that a challenge for you and and

674
00:31:13,990 --> 00:31:12,159
and how is that going for you

675
00:31:16,389 --> 00:31:14,000
well i'll have to report back into you

676
00:31:20,549 --> 00:31:16,399
after i'm uh how it goes for me when i'm

677
00:31:25,590 --> 00:31:23,190
that is a man's world and and last week

678
00:31:27,990 --> 00:31:25,600
i was actually at los alamos at the

679
00:31:29,990 --> 00:31:28,000
nuclear laboratory and i tell you that's

680
00:31:31,669 --> 00:31:30,000
a man's world as well so

681
00:31:33,830 --> 00:31:31,679
but you know i write about war and

682
00:31:35,830 --> 00:31:33,840
weapons and um

683
00:31:37,990 --> 00:31:35,840
as another once said to me

684
00:31:39,830 --> 00:31:38,000
make sure that you fish

685
00:31:40,710 --> 00:31:39,840
where there are fish

686
00:31:43,430 --> 00:31:40,720
and

687
00:31:45,909 --> 00:31:43,440
so i'm always looking for those really

688
00:31:47,750 --> 00:31:45,919
compelling stories about u.s national

689
00:31:50,149 --> 00:31:47,760
security and secrecy

690
00:31:52,549 --> 00:31:50,159
war and weapons and you're absolutely

691
00:31:53,830 --> 00:31:52,559
right those worlds are

692
00:31:55,350 --> 00:31:53,840
made up

693
00:31:56,389 --> 00:31:55,360
largely of men

694
00:31:57,990 --> 00:31:56,399
do they

695
00:31:59,110 --> 00:31:58,000
and i'm talking about men i'm talking

696
00:32:01,509 --> 00:31:59,120
about us

697
00:32:03,669 --> 00:32:01,519
when they hear from you first are they

698
00:32:05,190 --> 00:32:03,679
do they take you serious is it do you

699
00:32:07,269 --> 00:32:05,200
have to uh

700
00:32:10,230 --> 00:32:07,279
do you have to get hard with them and

701
00:32:11,669 --> 00:32:10,240
and and or you know how do you

702
00:32:14,470 --> 00:32:11,679
how do you uh

703
00:32:16,149 --> 00:32:14,480
i mean it's just uh i i can't imagine it

704
00:32:17,990 --> 00:32:16,159
would be tough enough being a man in a

705
00:32:20,230 --> 00:32:18,000
man's world uh covering this kind of

706
00:32:21,430 --> 00:32:20,240
stuff so what do you do

707
00:32:22,710 --> 00:32:21,440
you know what i love that you're asking

708
00:32:24,230 --> 00:32:22,720
me this question because i don't think

709
00:32:25,350 --> 00:32:24,240
anyone's ever asked me this question

710
00:32:38,470 --> 00:32:25,360
before

711
00:32:42,549 --> 00:32:40,549
i've lost your audio

712
00:32:44,389 --> 00:32:42,559
you're breaking up you're on atlanta oh

713
00:32:45,909 --> 00:32:44,399
my goodness okay you know what it is

714
00:32:48,230 --> 00:32:45,919
it's the old it's those men at the

715
00:32:49,509 --> 00:32:48,240
pentagon interrupting us you know okay

716
00:32:51,110 --> 00:32:49,519
so uh

717
00:32:53,750 --> 00:32:51,120
because i'm not moving i'm standing

718
00:32:55,110 --> 00:32:53,760
still in my office on a land line

719
00:32:57,669 --> 00:32:55,120
okay so

720
00:33:00,789 --> 00:32:57,679
go ahead and that that entire answer

721
00:33:03,750 --> 00:33:00,799
clipped out so let's uh let's you said

722
00:33:05,590 --> 00:33:03,760
i'm glad you're asking me that question

723
00:33:07,350 --> 00:33:05,600
yes no no it's delightful that you're

724
00:33:09,110 --> 00:33:07,360
asking me that question because i i

725
00:33:11,909 --> 00:33:09,120
don't think anyone's really asked me

726
00:33:13,269 --> 00:33:11,919
that before specifically um

727
00:33:15,750 --> 00:33:13,279
i mean

728
00:33:18,549 --> 00:33:15,760
a man's world you know how it works

729
00:33:21,110 --> 00:33:18,559
being a woman in a man's world

730
00:33:24,710 --> 00:33:21,120
but i know for me i just am always

731
00:33:27,350 --> 00:33:24,720
really compelled to find out answers

732
00:33:29,590 --> 00:33:27,360
uh to questions that i have and so

733
00:33:31,590 --> 00:33:29,600
my process is very much about just

734
00:33:34,389 --> 00:33:31,600
knocking on the door or calling back or

735
00:33:36,470 --> 00:33:34,399
emailing back until i can you know set

736
00:33:38,389 --> 00:33:36,480
up an interview with someone and and

737
00:33:40,549 --> 00:33:38,399
then show up and see what happens

738
00:33:41,350 --> 00:33:40,559
do they and again i'm talking about the

739
00:33:44,149 --> 00:33:41,360
men

740
00:33:46,310 --> 00:33:44,159
do they do you find a little

741
00:33:48,070 --> 00:33:46,320
them being a little hesitant before they

742
00:33:48,950 --> 00:33:48,080
start to open up

743
00:33:51,029 --> 00:33:48,960
i mean

744
00:33:53,509 --> 00:33:51,039
and i know that and i know that you deal

745
00:33:55,830 --> 00:33:53,519
with it so are some more open than

746
00:33:58,149 --> 00:33:55,840
others do some go right there out of the

747
00:34:00,630 --> 00:33:58,159
gate and or do you just kind of have to

748
00:34:01,669 --> 00:34:00,640
warm up to it

749
00:34:03,590 --> 00:34:01,679
i don't know you know you know what i

750
00:34:05,509 --> 00:34:03,600
think is different is it here's here's

751
00:34:07,029 --> 00:34:05,519
really where the line draws for me it's

752
00:34:08,950 --> 00:34:07,039
basically about

753
00:34:11,669 --> 00:34:08,960
comfort and discomfort

754
00:34:15,669 --> 00:34:11,679
i find certain people are like

755
00:34:17,270 --> 00:34:15,679
open and willing to talk to me now what

756
00:34:18,629 --> 00:34:17,280
they actually reveal to me is a

757
00:34:21,030 --> 00:34:18,639
different story

758
00:34:22,550 --> 00:34:21,040
but other people are extraordinarily

759
00:34:24,069 --> 00:34:22,560
uncomfortable

760
00:34:26,230 --> 00:34:24,079
and um

761
00:34:27,750 --> 00:34:26,240
and that's just you know and i i i

762
00:34:29,430 --> 00:34:27,760
wonder if there would be as

763
00:34:31,349 --> 00:34:29,440
uncomfortable with whoever it was that

764
00:34:33,270 --> 00:34:31,359
was talking they're just they just don't

765
00:34:34,950 --> 00:34:33,280
like having to discuss

766
00:34:36,629 --> 00:34:34,960
uh what it is they have to discuss

767
00:34:38,790 --> 00:34:36,639
here's another little thing that i often

768
00:34:40,310 --> 00:34:38,800
do and i really like most is

769
00:34:43,190 --> 00:34:40,320
i try to

770
00:34:44,629 --> 00:34:43,200
get the interviews from people's bosses

771
00:34:46,069 --> 00:34:44,639
first

772
00:34:50,470 --> 00:34:46,079
interesting

773
00:34:53,270 --> 00:34:50,480
because and i'll give you an example

774
00:34:55,030 --> 00:34:53,280
like right now i'm i'm working on some

775
00:34:57,589 --> 00:34:55,040
new stuff about

776
00:34:59,990 --> 00:34:57,599
high-energy weapons okay

777
00:35:02,870 --> 00:35:00,000
you know like laser beam weapons

778
00:35:06,550 --> 00:35:02,880
so what i did was i went and interviewed

779
00:35:09,030 --> 00:35:06,560
the man who invented the laser he's 99

780
00:35:10,870 --> 00:35:09,040
years old he won the nobel prize in

781
00:35:12,069 --> 00:35:10,880
1964.

782
00:35:16,150 --> 00:35:12,079
um

783
00:35:17,910 --> 00:35:16,160
and so because i interviewed him i

784
00:35:19,829 --> 00:35:17,920
suppose it's

785
00:35:21,349 --> 00:35:19,839
if anyone if the people i'm trying to

786
00:35:23,030 --> 00:35:21,359
interview that are dealing with those

787
00:35:25,829 --> 00:35:23,040
those that those weapon systems

788
00:35:27,109 --> 00:35:25,839
currently that have all been born of the

789
00:35:28,710 --> 00:35:27,119
laser

790
00:35:30,550 --> 00:35:28,720
and they don't want to talk about it

791
00:35:33,270 --> 00:35:30,560
it's a little almost embarrassing for

792
00:35:34,630 --> 00:35:33,280
them if the guy who invented the thing

793
00:35:36,470 --> 00:35:34,640
was willing to talk about it so why

794
00:35:38,710 --> 00:35:36,480
wouldn't they does it make sense yes

795
00:35:40,470 --> 00:35:38,720
absolutely absolutely

796
00:35:41,750 --> 00:35:40,480
and then you realize okay now we're

797
00:35:43,510 --> 00:35:41,760
talking about other reasons you don't

798
00:35:45,910 --> 00:35:43,520
want to talk about it because

799
00:35:48,710 --> 00:35:45,920
you know and then then you find that out

800
00:35:50,630 --> 00:35:48,720
but it it at least you have you have a

801
00:35:52,950 --> 00:35:50,640
way at least i find that then i really

802
00:35:55,430 --> 00:35:52,960
have a way in and also

803
00:35:57,990 --> 00:35:55,440
i have done my due diligence which i

804
00:36:00,790 --> 00:35:58,000
think is important in the world to show

805
00:36:03,270 --> 00:36:00,800
that i really do want to learn something

806
00:36:06,790 --> 00:36:03,280
about what it is they have to say

807
00:36:08,710 --> 00:36:06,800
with area 51 well there's well there's

808
00:36:10,710 --> 00:36:08,720
now there's two area 50 wants to talk

809
00:36:13,430 --> 00:36:10,720
about there is your book and then

810
00:36:16,710 --> 00:36:13,440
there's the new series that's coming out

811
00:36:19,829 --> 00:36:16,720
now from what i have read uh from the

812
00:36:23,430 --> 00:36:19,839
announcements from amc is that chris

813
00:36:24,710 --> 00:36:23,440
carter is basing everything on your book

814
00:36:26,069 --> 00:36:24,720
which is

815
00:36:28,870 --> 00:36:26,079
and i'm going to ask you about that in a

816
00:36:30,630 --> 00:36:28,880
second but that's controversial enough

817
00:36:32,710 --> 00:36:30,640
because there's so many well because

818
00:36:35,990 --> 00:36:32,720
there's so many views and nobody really

819
00:36:37,109 --> 00:36:36,000
knows about area 51 really um unless you

820
00:36:39,750 --> 00:36:37,119
work there

821
00:36:42,550 --> 00:36:39,760
so there's you know and we have when i

822
00:36:44,710 --> 00:36:42,560
say we the the collective in the united

823
00:36:46,710 --> 00:36:44,720
states we we have

824
00:36:49,430 --> 00:36:46,720
our basic ideas of what's going down in

825
00:36:51,670 --> 00:36:49,440
area 51 and and the the government's

826
00:36:53,270 --> 00:36:51,680
gonna tell you okay we research

827
00:36:55,190 --> 00:36:53,280
our top secret aircraft there that's

828
00:36:56,630 --> 00:36:55,200
what goes on okay all right so there's

829
00:36:58,950 --> 00:36:56,640
your status quo

830
00:37:02,710 --> 00:36:58,960
then there is the you

831
00:37:04,710 --> 00:37:02,720
ufology that that genre that uh

832
00:37:07,670 --> 00:37:04,720
that side of

833
00:37:10,310 --> 00:37:07,680
that look i should say which is

834
00:37:13,349 --> 00:37:10,320
roswell uh

835
00:37:16,470 --> 00:37:13,359
aliens underground we keep them there we

836
00:37:18,390 --> 00:37:16,480
have a we have a nice hotel holiday inn

837
00:37:20,550 --> 00:37:18,400
set up for the aliens underneath the

838
00:37:21,589 --> 00:37:20,560
base and then there's the one that you

839
00:37:24,310 --> 00:37:21,599
did

840
00:37:26,069 --> 00:37:24,320
in area 51. now

841
00:37:26,870 --> 00:37:26,079
i know that

842
00:37:29,990 --> 00:37:26,880
the

843
00:37:32,230 --> 00:37:30,000
ufo community didn't exactly embrace

844
00:37:33,910 --> 00:37:32,240
because you kind of pooh-poohed

845
00:37:35,190 --> 00:37:33,920
everybody's vision about what's been

846
00:37:37,190 --> 00:37:35,200
going on there

847
00:37:39,990 --> 00:37:37,200
so let's let's talk about that

848
00:37:41,109 --> 00:37:40,000
specifically and is chris carter going

849
00:37:44,069 --> 00:37:41,119
to go

850
00:37:47,430 --> 00:37:44,079
straight at your book and and honor the

851
00:37:55,510 --> 00:37:48,790
okay so

852
00:38:00,230 --> 00:37:58,390
yeah they're wow that is crazy

853
00:38:02,390 --> 00:38:00,240
i mean i'm just standing right here

854
00:38:04,390 --> 00:38:02,400
and now you're back okay keep going keep

855
00:38:05,430 --> 00:38:04,400
going yeah

856
00:38:07,349 --> 00:38:05,440
um

857
00:38:08,710 --> 00:38:07,359
you know i will add in here it's funny

858
00:38:09,829 --> 00:38:08,720
because we just have the per this is the

859
00:38:11,990 --> 00:38:09,839
perfect living room to have this

860
00:38:14,069 --> 00:38:12,000
conversation but sometimes you know i do

861
00:38:16,630 --> 00:38:14,079
talk to a lot of guys who are who work

862
00:38:18,470 --> 00:38:16,640
in intelligence and um

863
00:38:20,470 --> 00:38:18,480
and they're really interesting you know

864
00:38:23,030 --> 00:38:20,480
and i obviously we all have sources that

865
00:38:24,870 --> 00:38:23,040
you know tell us when you're a reporter

866
00:38:26,630 --> 00:38:24,880
and the guys often tell me that the guys

867
00:38:29,030 --> 00:38:26,640
they know in nsa let's put it that way

868
00:38:32,150 --> 00:38:29,040
or that the people that are listening

869
00:38:34,470 --> 00:38:32,160
often give people little winks and nods

870
00:38:36,630 --> 00:38:34,480
in the form of you know

871
00:38:38,790 --> 00:38:36,640
let's call it clicks and

872
00:38:40,710 --> 00:38:38,800
fade out to let you know certain things

873
00:38:42,630 --> 00:38:40,720
and so i always get a double smile

874
00:38:45,750 --> 00:38:42,640
whenever it happens because i think are

875
00:38:48,710 --> 00:38:45,760
the good guys letting me know or

876
00:38:49,829 --> 00:38:48,720
does you know my phone service stink

877
00:38:52,310 --> 00:38:49,839
no and

878
00:38:54,150 --> 00:38:52,320
with this this is the thing annie and

879
00:38:57,750 --> 00:38:54,160
it's really true

880
00:39:01,270 --> 00:38:57,760
i i did a sports show for years

881
00:39:03,349 --> 00:39:01,280
okay out of this very same studio

882
00:39:07,349 --> 00:39:03,359
same equipment same everything and for

883
00:39:11,589 --> 00:39:07,359
years i never had an issue nothing

884
00:39:13,510 --> 00:39:11,599
phone calls internet uh links ever

885
00:39:14,550 --> 00:39:13,520
television uh

886
00:39:17,349 --> 00:39:14,560
dish

887
00:39:19,349 --> 00:39:17,359
uh satellites everything was perfect

888
00:39:22,069 --> 00:39:19,359
i started doing this show

889
00:39:24,710 --> 00:39:22,079
and there is one hiccup oh it's it's

890
00:39:26,710 --> 00:39:24,720
like the craziest most frustrating thing

891
00:39:29,430 --> 00:39:26,720
but i have been warned

892
00:39:30,710 --> 00:39:29,440
by all of the top people in this field

893
00:39:32,390 --> 00:39:30,720
get ready

894
00:39:34,470 --> 00:39:32,400
they're listening and it's going to

895
00:39:35,910 --> 00:39:34,480
happen and you just have to be ready for

896
00:39:38,230 --> 00:39:35,920
it and it's going to happen every single

897
00:39:39,589 --> 00:39:38,240
day and it's really funny it really does

898
00:39:41,430 --> 00:39:39,599
and

899
00:39:43,190 --> 00:39:41,440
have you found that

900
00:39:44,790 --> 00:39:43,200
do you feel now you know now you know

901
00:39:46,470 --> 00:39:44,800
you have friends in the right places

902
00:39:48,950 --> 00:39:46,480
yeah i guess so i guess so giving you

903
00:39:49,750 --> 00:39:48,960
the they're giving you a little heads up

904
00:39:52,230 --> 00:39:49,760
you know

905
00:39:54,870 --> 00:39:52,240
but okay so jumping back to area 51 and

906
00:39:58,310 --> 00:39:54,880
my ending and this idea of you know

907
00:40:01,510 --> 00:39:58,320
alien the idea of aliens at area 51

908
00:40:03,190 --> 00:40:01,520
versus something else at area 51 versus

909
00:40:04,950 --> 00:40:03,200
government secrecy keeping everything

910
00:40:06,790 --> 00:40:04,960
secret remember

911
00:40:11,349 --> 00:40:06,800
i'm my book

912
00:40:14,630 --> 00:40:11,359
is one part of a very big story you know

913
00:40:15,829 --> 00:40:14,640
but it's only one part i think it's a

914
00:40:18,790 --> 00:40:15,839
interesting

915
00:40:21,829 --> 00:40:18,800
informative part obviously because i

916
00:40:24,310 --> 00:40:21,839
really enjoyed interviewing the 75 men

917
00:40:26,630 --> 00:40:24,320
who lived and worked at area 51 for

918
00:40:28,630 --> 00:40:26,640
extended periods of time and shared

919
00:40:32,390 --> 00:40:28,640
their stories with me and they range

920
00:40:34,710 --> 00:40:32,400
from you know spy pilots to scientists

921
00:40:35,750 --> 00:40:34,720
to security guards and everybody in

922
00:40:39,750 --> 00:40:35,760
between

923
00:40:43,589 --> 00:40:39,760
and so the information that i have is

924
00:40:45,349 --> 00:40:43,599
from them and also from documents that i

925
00:40:47,589 --> 00:40:45,359
researched at different libraries and

926
00:40:50,950 --> 00:40:47,599
archives and then i have this ending of

927
00:40:54,550 --> 00:40:50,960
my book which is very controversial for

928
00:40:58,470 --> 00:40:54,560
because i use a single source who worked

929
00:41:01,349 --> 00:40:58,480
for a very controversial organization at

930
00:41:03,430 --> 00:41:01,359
area 51 called eg g they did nuclear

931
00:41:05,270 --> 00:41:03,440
weapons they did triggering devices they

932
00:41:07,589 --> 00:41:05,280
also did lots of other things and some

933
00:41:10,230 --> 00:41:07,599
nefarious things and i tell at the end

934
00:41:12,390 --> 00:41:10,240
of my book one story

935
00:41:14,230 --> 00:41:12,400
from one man

936
00:41:16,230 --> 00:41:14,240
and the reason i chose to tell it was

937
00:41:18,870 --> 00:41:16,240
because i believe him and i still am in

938
00:41:21,030 --> 00:41:18,880
contact with him and i still believe him

939
00:41:23,349 --> 00:41:21,040
and he stands by his story but again

940
00:41:25,670 --> 00:41:23,359
that's one story many people have come

941
00:41:27,430 --> 00:41:25,680
to me in all of my different you know

942
00:41:29,190 --> 00:41:27,440
public speaking events afterwards and

943
00:41:30,230 --> 00:41:29,200
said listen you know i've had people

944
00:41:32,710 --> 00:41:30,240
tell me

945
00:41:34,790 --> 00:41:32,720
you've you're now a plant for the cia

946
00:41:36,550 --> 00:41:34,800
you're part of the disinformation i've

947
00:41:38,790 --> 00:41:36,560
had other people tell me you hit it

948
00:41:41,430 --> 00:41:38,800
right on i've had other people tell me

949
00:41:44,230 --> 00:41:41,440
you're out of your mind right you know

950
00:41:45,109 --> 00:41:44,240
the truth is out there as chris likes to

951
00:41:47,430 --> 00:41:45,119
say

952
00:41:50,870 --> 00:41:47,440
but what is that truth and

953
00:41:52,550 --> 00:41:50,880
what i do know is that it's important to

954
00:41:54,470 --> 00:41:52,560
continue to seek the truth and that's

955
00:41:55,829 --> 00:41:54,480
why i write non-fiction

956
00:41:57,190 --> 00:41:55,839
now

957
00:41:58,470 --> 00:41:57,200
the second part of your question is what

958
00:41:59,910 --> 00:41:58,480
is chris carter going to do with the

959
00:42:03,190 --> 00:41:59,920
book and that's what's exciting we

960
00:42:05,670 --> 00:42:03,200
actually all we had a meeting today um

961
00:42:07,510 --> 00:42:05,680
about you know as we work on this and

962
00:42:09,750 --> 00:42:07,520
and it's such a great team you know you

963
00:42:12,150 --> 00:42:09,760
you can't i can't feel in better hands

964
00:42:14,710 --> 00:42:12,160
with gail and heard and chris carter and

965
00:42:17,589 --> 00:42:14,720
we talk a lot about um you know the

966
00:42:19,990 --> 00:42:17,599
story and without giving anything away

967
00:42:23,270 --> 00:42:20,000
obviously i mean whenever you're

968
00:42:26,790 --> 00:42:23,280
adapting a scripted fictional television

969
00:42:28,790 --> 00:42:26,800
series from a non-fiction book

970
00:42:30,790 --> 00:42:28,800
the writer the writers that you know

971
00:42:33,430 --> 00:42:30,800
with chris leading the team of writers

972
00:42:35,589 --> 00:42:33,440
they it's really important that they

973
00:42:36,550 --> 00:42:35,599
take their vision

974
00:42:39,190 --> 00:42:36,560
to

975
00:42:42,309 --> 00:42:39,200
that series and so

976
00:42:43,510 --> 00:42:42,319
i would say if anything my book serves

977
00:42:48,150 --> 00:42:43,520
as the

978
00:42:50,950 --> 00:42:48,160
jumping off point i mean call it what

979
00:42:53,109 --> 00:42:50,960
you will but i think the tv series is so

980
00:42:55,349 --> 00:42:53,119
exciting because basically what it does

981
00:42:56,150 --> 00:42:55,359
is it takes all the same themes that i

982
00:42:58,069 --> 00:42:56,160
think

983
00:43:00,230 --> 00:42:58,079
we're all interested in you know

984
00:43:01,109 --> 00:43:00,240
secretly the truth

985
00:43:03,510 --> 00:43:01,119
um

986
00:43:06,950 --> 00:43:03,520
government propaganda

987
00:43:08,950 --> 00:43:06,960
those ideas who's controlling the story

988
00:43:10,230 --> 00:43:08,960
what really is the story it takes all

989
00:43:13,750 --> 00:43:10,240
those themes

990
00:43:16,150 --> 00:43:13,760
and it brings them to life with this

991
00:43:18,390 --> 00:43:16,160
archetype of area 51 at the center i

992
00:43:21,990 --> 00:43:18,400
mean it's undeniab and roswell i mean

993
00:43:24,230 --> 00:43:22,000
you cannot deny that this is an unsolved

994
00:43:26,230 --> 00:43:24,240
mystery

995
00:43:27,829 --> 00:43:26,240
the freedom that you have with a guy

996
00:43:29,349 --> 00:43:27,839
like chris carter because there's

997
00:43:30,710 --> 00:43:29,359
nothing that you could

998
00:43:33,190 --> 00:43:30,720
write about

999
00:43:35,910 --> 00:43:33,200
and have him go ah you know that's too

1000
00:43:38,550 --> 00:43:35,920
out there well you know because he

1001
00:43:40,069 --> 00:43:38,560
you know he is as open-minded as it gets

1002
00:43:43,349 --> 00:43:40,079
and we all know that i mean that just

1003
00:43:45,109 --> 00:43:43,359
goes without saying but with that when

1004
00:43:48,390 --> 00:43:45,119
you're dealing with fiction and

1005
00:43:50,150 --> 00:43:48,400
non-fiction and government secrecy and

1006
00:43:52,870 --> 00:43:50,160
obviously what your

1007
00:43:54,550 --> 00:43:52,880
what area 51 is about

1008
00:43:57,270 --> 00:43:54,560
is has there been any

1009
00:43:59,510 --> 00:43:57,280
government interference

1010
00:44:02,150 --> 00:43:59,520
do do you have to disclose to anybody

1011
00:44:04,230 --> 00:44:02,160
what you guys are potentially

1012
00:44:06,630 --> 00:44:04,240
going to show on the screen

1013
00:44:08,710 --> 00:44:06,640
no i mean i mean to who who you know the

1014
00:44:09,510 --> 00:44:08,720
world of fiction the world of fiction

1015
00:44:11,430 --> 00:44:09,520
that's

1016
00:44:13,589 --> 00:44:11,440
what sort of one i mean this is my first

1017
00:44:15,829 --> 00:44:13,599
foray into that arena and i'm really

1018
00:44:17,109 --> 00:44:15,839
enjoying it because i think they they

1019
00:44:19,030 --> 00:44:17,119
cross over all the time but you know

1020
00:44:21,109 --> 00:44:19,040
what is fascinating is

1021
00:44:22,870 --> 00:44:21,119
uh and one of the reasons

1022
00:44:25,109 --> 00:44:22,880
without saying too much about why i'm at

1023
00:44:27,190 --> 00:44:25,119
the pentagon next week is i'm really

1024
00:44:28,870 --> 00:44:27,200
looking at um

1025
00:44:31,430 --> 00:44:28,880
this is for something this is for my new

1026
00:44:33,829 --> 00:44:31,440
book which is actually going to be

1027
00:44:38,230 --> 00:44:33,839
i think sort of top books together area

1028
00:44:46,150 --> 00:44:38,240
51 is the first of the trilogy then

1029
00:44:51,349 --> 00:44:48,150
and then with this book i take you to

1030
00:44:53,109 --> 00:44:51,359
the future and what gets looked at a lot

1031
00:44:55,829 --> 00:44:53,119
is how the pentagon

1032
00:44:58,950 --> 00:44:55,839
uses science fiction

1033
00:45:02,069 --> 00:44:58,960
uh in its own research and development

1034
00:45:05,190 --> 00:45:02,079
in other words uses these ideas

1035
00:45:07,190 --> 00:45:05,200
that are born of the mind

1036
00:45:09,910 --> 00:45:07,200
and

1037
00:45:12,470 --> 00:45:09,920
this you know annie i gotta tell you

1038
00:45:15,030 --> 00:45:12,480
your phone is cutting in and out right

1039
00:45:16,470 --> 00:45:15,040
at these key moments and i'm wondering i

1040
00:45:18,550 --> 00:45:16,480
think we're being i think we're being

1041
00:45:20,230 --> 00:45:18,560
listened to that every time i say the

1042
00:45:22,790 --> 00:45:20,240
pentagon they you know yeah that is

1043
00:45:23,990 --> 00:45:22,800
bizarre hey okay so i i don't know if

1044
00:45:26,309 --> 00:45:24,000
you're going to tell me why you're going

1045
00:45:28,230 --> 00:45:26,319
to the pentagon but were you invited or

1046
00:45:29,750 --> 00:45:28,240
did you ask to go

1047
00:45:31,670 --> 00:45:29,760
oh well you know as a journalist i'm

1048
00:45:34,150 --> 00:45:31,680
always seeking interviews with people i

1049
00:45:36,950 --> 00:45:34,160
mean that's part of the job okay

1050
00:45:38,150 --> 00:45:36,960
sir um so you've been there before

1051
00:45:40,630 --> 00:45:38,160
you know i've never been there before

1052
00:45:42,470 --> 00:45:40,640
okay all right yeah i've been to dia

1053
00:45:45,589 --> 00:45:42,480
that's like really interesting

1054
00:45:46,950 --> 00:45:45,599
intelligence agency this is just nuts

1055
00:45:49,109 --> 00:45:46,960
i'm listening to

1056
00:45:51,349 --> 00:45:49,119
you're on a phone line this isn't skype

1057
00:45:54,069 --> 00:45:51,359
this is just a phone line straight in

1058
00:45:55,589 --> 00:45:54,079
and and you and i spoke before the show

1059
00:45:57,430 --> 00:45:55,599
you have any problems well that well

1060
00:46:00,710 --> 00:45:57,440
that's when they found out you know

1061
00:46:02,390 --> 00:46:00,720
you're on this show of all shows um okay

1062
00:46:05,109 --> 00:46:02,400
now

1063
00:46:07,030 --> 00:46:05,119
uh the book is out i mean area 51's been

1064
00:46:09,030 --> 00:46:07,040
out for a while we know what the book is

1065
00:46:10,950 --> 00:46:09,040
about and so

1066
00:46:12,870 --> 00:46:10,960
can you

1067
00:46:14,710 --> 00:46:12,880
tell us

1068
00:46:18,150 --> 00:46:14,720
without giving away what chris is going

1069
00:46:19,829 --> 00:46:18,160
to do in the series but again we we know

1070
00:46:23,030 --> 00:46:19,839
what what the

1071
00:46:24,950 --> 00:46:23,040
you know the whole soviet stalin

1072
00:46:26,630 --> 00:46:24,960
uh flying sauce so i'm going to intro

1073
00:46:28,390 --> 00:46:26,640
that part of it would you you want to

1074
00:46:30,150 --> 00:46:28,400
tell everybody uh

1075
00:46:32,790 --> 00:46:30,160
exactly what we're talking about because

1076
00:46:34,950 --> 00:46:32,800
they have no idea

1077
00:46:37,670 --> 00:46:34,960
well in the end you mean about the end

1078
00:46:40,069 --> 00:46:37,680
of my book yeah as a yeah as opposed to

1079
00:46:41,589 --> 00:46:40,079
the roswell um

1080
00:46:44,069 --> 00:46:41,599
uh version

1081
00:46:46,230 --> 00:46:44,079
i should say well what you know and i'm

1082
00:46:47,589 --> 00:46:46,240
sure i'm i'm sure

1083
00:46:49,829 --> 00:46:47,599
you know listeners are familiar with

1084
00:46:51,270 --> 00:46:49,839
this because people got very upset about

1085
00:46:54,150 --> 00:46:51,280
this and it was interesting because i

1086
00:46:57,670 --> 00:46:54,160
got i i took a lot of heat from

1087
00:46:58,950 --> 00:46:57,680
those who really follow the idea of ufos

1088
00:47:01,349 --> 00:46:58,960
and aliens

1089
00:47:03,510 --> 00:47:01,359
um and i got i took a lot of heat from a

1090
00:47:04,870 --> 00:47:03,520
lot of military people who did not like

1091
00:47:06,390 --> 00:47:04,880
what i wrote either so it was like

1092
00:47:07,190 --> 00:47:06,400
really being between a rock and a hard

1093
00:47:09,910 --> 00:47:07,200
place

1094
00:47:11,109 --> 00:47:09,920
but because i wrote i reported what was

1095
00:47:14,950 --> 00:47:11,119
told to me

1096
00:47:18,230 --> 00:47:14,960
by an engineer who worked with eg g

1097
00:47:20,950 --> 00:47:18,240
who actually was part of the team

1098
00:47:24,309 --> 00:47:20,960
that worked to reverse engineer

1099
00:47:27,109 --> 00:47:24,319
the craft and according to him the craft

1100
00:47:30,069 --> 00:47:27,119
now remember this is according to him

1101
00:47:32,630 --> 00:47:30,079
right the craft did not come from outer

1102
00:47:34,550 --> 00:47:32,640
space it came from russia

1103
00:47:35,829 --> 00:47:34,560
it came from stalin

1104
00:47:39,829 --> 00:47:35,839
and it was

1105
00:47:42,309 --> 00:47:39,839
filled with child size aviators so they

1106
00:47:45,030 --> 00:47:42,319
looked like aliens

1107
00:47:47,349 --> 00:47:45,040
but they were actually part of horrific

1108
00:47:50,710 --> 00:47:47,359
human experiments meant to look like

1109
00:47:52,630 --> 00:47:50,720
aliens stalin's idea and his obsession

1110
00:47:55,510 --> 00:47:52,640
according to this engineer

1111
00:47:58,630 --> 00:47:55,520
was the war of the worlds and because at

1112
00:48:00,950 --> 00:47:58,640
the time in 1947 there was no atomic

1113
00:48:04,150 --> 00:48:00,960
bomb on the soviet side of things

1114
00:48:07,910 --> 00:48:04,160
and stalin hated truman and hated truman

1115
00:48:10,390 --> 00:48:07,920
being ahead in the atomic game

1116
00:48:13,510 --> 00:48:10,400
pulled the black propaganda card and

1117
00:48:14,870 --> 00:48:13,520
said you may have the atomic bomb but i

1118
00:48:18,390 --> 00:48:14,880
have the control of the people through

1119
00:48:20,790 --> 00:48:18,400
propaganda and the plan was to terrify

1120
00:48:22,630 --> 00:48:20,800
americans in this region of the world

1121
00:48:24,470 --> 00:48:22,640
that was so closely linked with a taunt

1122
00:48:26,390 --> 00:48:24,480
with atomic bomb you had sandia where it

1123
00:48:28,710 --> 00:48:26,400
was being manufactured you had los

1124
00:48:31,510 --> 00:48:28,720
alamos where it was being

1125
00:48:33,510 --> 00:48:31,520
designed scientifically and engineered

1126
00:48:35,109 --> 00:48:33,520
and you had the white sands missile

1127
00:48:37,670 --> 00:48:35,119
range there where all the rocket tests

1128
00:48:40,150 --> 00:48:37,680
were going on and the idea was that

1129
00:48:42,230 --> 00:48:40,160
stalin would create a war of the world

1130
00:48:45,190 --> 00:48:42,240
scenario there

1131
00:48:47,990 --> 00:48:45,200
and so that is what i was told

1132
00:48:50,950 --> 00:48:48,000
and after working with this source for

1133
00:48:53,190 --> 00:48:50,960
you know a hundred interviews and

1134
00:49:00,069 --> 00:48:53,200
almost two years

1135
00:49:04,309 --> 00:49:02,230
who he was knowing he was who he was

1136
00:49:14,390 --> 00:49:04,319
knowing his place within the atomic

1137
00:49:19,510 --> 00:49:17,349
unbelievable

1138
00:49:23,270 --> 00:49:19,520
all of that was cut out

1139
00:49:25,829 --> 00:49:23,280
now this is it and it and it's happening

1140
00:49:27,589 --> 00:49:25,839
you can tell it's right um

1141
00:49:28,470 --> 00:49:27,599
it's on a sentence and then it comes

1142
00:49:30,069 --> 00:49:28,480
back

1143
00:49:31,829 --> 00:49:30,079
at the end of the sentence somebody's

1144
00:49:32,790 --> 00:49:31,839
somebody's listening to us annie that's

1145
00:49:38,069 --> 00:49:32,800
trippy

1146
00:49:42,150 --> 00:49:40,549
you know um i'm going to i'm going to

1147
00:49:44,630 --> 00:49:42,160
break to a commercial

1148
00:49:47,270 --> 00:49:44,640
and i'm going to call you right back

1149
00:49:49,510 --> 00:49:47,280
let's do that uh um and then uh we'll

1150
00:49:51,349 --> 00:49:49,520
reset this phone line how's that sound

1151
00:49:53,589 --> 00:49:51,359
sounds great okay let's do it

1152
00:49:56,390 --> 00:49:53,599
all right um

1153
00:49:59,430 --> 00:49:56,400
absolutely bizarre and you are listening

1154
00:50:01,829 --> 00:49:59,440
to this as i am listening to it

1155
00:50:04,230 --> 00:50:01,839
so i'm going to take a quick break

1156
00:50:05,990 --> 00:50:04,240
i'm going to reset here

1157
00:50:08,069 --> 00:50:06,000
we call andy back and reset the phone

1158
00:50:09,990 --> 00:50:08,079
line that's bizarre

1159
00:50:24,470 --> 00:50:10,000
let's mess with the nsa i'll be back

1160
00:50:32,870 --> 00:50:27,190
brian taylor ninja badass extraordinaire

1161
00:50:37,150 --> 00:50:33,790
hey

1162
00:50:39,829 --> 00:50:37,160
jcr in your face

1163
00:51:10,790 --> 00:50:39,839
jimmychurchradio.com on the dark matter

1164
00:51:18,549 --> 00:51:13,990
i'm literally resetting you ready

1165
00:51:23,750 --> 00:51:20,790
okay

1166
00:51:25,430 --> 00:51:23,760
let's try this again

1167
00:51:27,190 --> 00:51:25,440
are you there we're back with or without

1168
00:51:29,109 --> 00:51:27,200
with or without the eavesdroppers yeah

1169
00:51:31,190 --> 00:51:29,119
see you're nice and crisp and clear it's

1170
00:51:32,630 --> 00:51:31,200
just so weird somebody's listening okay

1171
00:51:34,230 --> 00:51:32,640
so now

1172
00:51:35,589 --> 00:51:34,240
uh

1173
00:51:45,270 --> 00:51:35,599
the

1174
00:51:49,190 --> 00:51:45,280
version of operation paperclip was that

1175
00:51:51,190 --> 00:51:49,200
a nazi uh third reich type of craft and

1176
00:51:53,829 --> 00:51:51,200
and what was the propulsion system on

1177
00:51:55,910 --> 00:51:53,839
that was it conventional i mean

1178
00:51:58,069 --> 00:51:55,920
i'm a little confused but we backward

1179
00:52:00,549 --> 00:51:58,079
engineered that

1180
00:52:02,470 --> 00:52:00,559
and that's what crashed in roswell

1181
00:52:04,069 --> 00:52:02,480
correct

1182
00:52:06,309 --> 00:52:04,079
according to the engineer and i rate

1183
00:52:08,630 --> 00:52:06,319
this very specifically in the book as he

1184
00:52:12,470 --> 00:52:08,640
told me right but yes you are right that

1185
00:52:14,950 --> 00:52:12,480
it was an aircraft designed by two nazi

1186
00:52:17,910 --> 00:52:14,960
aircraft designers named rymar and

1187
00:52:20,710 --> 00:52:17,920
walter horton they created the horton

1188
00:52:23,510 --> 00:52:20,720
wing that flying wing which later we

1189
00:52:24,950 --> 00:52:23,520
stole and made the b2 b-52 bomber

1190
00:52:27,109 --> 00:52:24,960
but also

1191
00:52:29,190 --> 00:52:27,119
um they when if you look in my book in

1192
00:52:30,549 --> 00:52:29,200
the area 51 book i have these

1193
00:52:32,630 --> 00:52:30,559
photographs i don't think were ever

1194
00:52:34,790 --> 00:52:32,640
published before where you see the

1195
00:52:37,349 --> 00:52:34,800
horton brothers created

1196
00:52:39,910 --> 00:52:37,359
parabolic airplanes so they're like

1197
00:52:41,510 --> 00:52:39,920
almost a full circle a full flying

1198
00:52:44,230 --> 00:52:41,520
circle and

1199
00:52:45,030 --> 00:52:44,240
the and there are drawings

1200
00:52:47,349 --> 00:52:45,040
for

1201
00:52:48,470 --> 00:52:47,359
a flying saucer and what was also

1202
00:52:50,549 --> 00:52:48,480
interesting which was a lot of the

1203
00:52:53,990 --> 00:52:50,559
documentation which i presented in area

1204
00:52:55,990 --> 00:52:54,000
51 showed that right after

1205
00:52:56,790 --> 00:52:56,000
the crash at roswell

1206
00:52:58,630 --> 00:52:56,800
the

1207
00:53:01,829 --> 00:52:58,640
air force

1208
00:53:04,549 --> 00:53:01,839
created a giant manhunt for walter and

1209
00:53:06,069 --> 00:53:04,559
rymar horton they had all this access to

1210
00:53:09,829 --> 00:53:06,079
all these nazi scientists as i write in

1211
00:53:12,630 --> 00:53:09,839
paperclip um and yet suddenly they were

1212
00:53:16,630 --> 00:53:12,640
interested in these two guys

1213
00:53:17,430 --> 00:53:16,640
and so this story has resonance

1214
00:53:19,030 --> 00:53:17,440
in

1215
00:53:22,470 --> 00:53:19,040
the nazis

1216
00:53:24,390 --> 00:53:22,480
and then these two brothers actually

1217
00:53:26,470 --> 00:53:24,400
went to

1218
00:53:28,309 --> 00:53:26,480
made contact with stalin and as i write

1219
00:53:30,950 --> 00:53:28,319
in the book

1220
00:53:33,430 --> 00:53:30,960
as soon as that unveils itself in these

1221
00:53:35,589 --> 00:53:33,440
national archives documents you know the

1222
00:53:38,309 --> 00:53:35,599
last sort of line in the file is the

1223
00:53:40,710 --> 00:53:38,319
horton brothers concert confirmed

1224
00:53:43,109 --> 00:53:40,720
you know communication with the soviets

1225
00:53:44,390 --> 00:53:43,119
and then there's no more documentation

1226
00:53:50,309 --> 00:53:44,400
did he

1227
00:53:52,309 --> 00:53:50,319
craft looked like

1228
00:53:53,510 --> 00:53:52,319
yes and i and i put i i write that in

1229
00:53:55,510 --> 00:53:53,520
there you know it was round it was a

1230
00:53:56,950 --> 00:53:55,520
very very classic flying closer but you

1231
00:53:59,030 --> 00:53:56,960
asked me about the propulsion system and

1232
00:54:01,349 --> 00:53:59,040
that's interesting too because that is

1233
00:54:03,430 --> 00:54:01,359
that unconventional propulsion system i

1234
00:54:05,109 --> 00:54:03,440
don't know i took so much heat for this

1235
00:54:07,589 --> 00:54:05,119
and i think you know it's it's

1236
00:54:09,670 --> 00:54:07,599
interesting because um

1237
00:54:11,910 --> 00:54:09,680
that's where

1238
00:54:13,990 --> 00:54:11,920
you know not being a scientist doesn't

1239
00:54:14,870 --> 00:54:14,000
help let's put it that way because you

1240
00:54:17,670 --> 00:54:14,880
know

1241
00:54:19,829 --> 00:54:17,680
i cannot tell you what that propulsion

1242
00:54:23,030 --> 00:54:19,839
is system is

1243
00:54:25,430 --> 00:54:23,040
the there's uh i want everybody to go to

1244
00:54:27,190 --> 00:54:25,440
uh jimmy trudio.com you can scroll down

1245
00:54:29,030 --> 00:54:27,200
it's in the normal spot in the guest

1246
00:54:31,750 --> 00:54:29,040
gallery section

1247
00:54:34,950 --> 00:54:31,760
and annie has provided us

1248
00:54:38,470 --> 00:54:34,960
seven photographs the bottom three

1249
00:54:39,349 --> 00:54:38,480
are from area 51 and and

1250
00:54:41,030 --> 00:54:39,359
um

1251
00:54:42,470 --> 00:54:41,040
we'll we'll talk about these three but

1252
00:54:47,510 --> 00:54:42,480
the middle

1253
00:54:49,510 --> 00:54:47,520
and this obviously is one of the

1254
00:54:53,349 --> 00:54:49,520
prototypes this is probably one of the

1255
00:54:57,030 --> 00:54:53,359
ones that is made out of wood but

1256
00:55:00,790 --> 00:54:57,040
this photograph is uh and this design is

1257
00:55:02,390 --> 00:55:00,800
very reminiscent of what was seen up in

1258
00:55:06,230 --> 00:55:02,400
washington

1259
00:55:08,630 --> 00:55:06,240
first before roswell and yes and it's

1260
00:55:11,430 --> 00:55:08,640
it's it's an exact

1261
00:55:13,190 --> 00:55:11,440
as far as a description goes if i was

1262
00:55:14,710 --> 00:55:13,200
going to draw

1263
00:55:16,790 --> 00:55:14,720
um

1264
00:55:18,069 --> 00:55:16,800
that that's exactly what it reminds me

1265
00:55:23,349 --> 00:55:18,079
of

1266
00:55:26,710 --> 00:55:23,359
the story you know and

1267
00:55:30,870 --> 00:55:26,720
what i find fascinating is

1268
00:55:32,950 --> 00:55:30,880
the the hunt for information and how

1269
00:55:35,430 --> 00:55:32,960
more gets revealed

1270
00:55:36,549 --> 00:55:35,440
as you keep looking and so it's why i

1271
00:55:38,230 --> 00:55:36,559
always

1272
00:55:40,150 --> 00:55:38,240
caution

1273
00:55:43,109 --> 00:55:40,160
my own self and also readers and

1274
00:55:45,910 --> 00:55:43,119
listeners to being convinced of their

1275
00:55:47,750 --> 00:55:45,920
own ideas i think it's really important

1276
00:55:50,069 --> 00:55:47,760
to have conviction

1277
00:55:52,390 --> 00:55:50,079
but there's a something really

1278
00:55:54,470 --> 00:55:52,400
significant about being able to maintain

1279
00:55:57,510 --> 00:55:54,480
this idea of flexibility with your

1280
00:55:59,109 --> 00:55:57,520
thinking because there are so you know

1281
00:56:01,670 --> 00:55:59,119
with all the information being

1282
00:56:03,750 --> 00:56:01,680
controlled in so many different mediums

1283
00:56:06,630 --> 00:56:03,760
for many reasons

1284
00:56:09,270 --> 00:56:06,640
some good some nefarious some simply

1285
00:56:11,030 --> 00:56:09,280
because it gets lost that i always

1286
00:56:12,870 --> 00:56:11,040
really adhere to that idea that there is

1287
00:56:14,470 --> 00:56:12,880
more out there and there is more to be

1288
00:56:15,430 --> 00:56:14,480
revealed

1289
00:56:17,750 --> 00:56:15,440
where

1290
00:56:20,069 --> 00:56:17,760
did mangala was mangala something that

1291
00:56:22,630 --> 00:56:20,079
you found out on your own or was this

1292
00:56:25,430 --> 00:56:22,640
also disclosed and if it was

1293
00:56:27,910 --> 00:56:25,440
how was the middle of stalin connection

1294
00:56:28,829 --> 00:56:27,920
revealed how did your source

1295
00:56:30,390 --> 00:56:28,839
put that

1296
00:56:34,069 --> 00:56:30,400
together

1297
00:56:35,829 --> 00:56:34,079
that was the very first

1298
00:56:37,829 --> 00:56:35,839
point

1299
00:56:39,670 --> 00:56:37,839
you know that was

1300
00:56:45,910 --> 00:56:39,680
the

1301
00:56:47,109 --> 00:56:45,920
what my source was dealing with and

1302
00:56:48,870 --> 00:56:47,119
really

1303
00:56:51,270 --> 00:56:48,880
has always been

1304
00:56:53,190 --> 00:56:51,280
for me the mainstay of

1305
00:56:55,109 --> 00:56:53,200
of his credibility because i believe

1306
00:56:58,870 --> 00:56:55,119
that what he told me

1307
00:57:01,030 --> 00:56:58,880
he told me because it was

1308
00:57:02,870 --> 00:57:01,040
an enormous burden to him because

1309
00:57:04,230 --> 00:57:02,880
remember he also

1310
00:57:05,430 --> 00:57:04,240
unveils

1311
00:57:09,430 --> 00:57:05,440
that

1312
00:57:12,390 --> 00:57:09,440
conducted by stalin

1313
00:57:14,549 --> 00:57:12,400
using mangala and his horrific

1314
00:57:16,470 --> 00:57:14,559
concentration camp science

1315
00:57:18,870 --> 00:57:16,480
to create these

1316
00:57:21,670 --> 00:57:18,880
alien-looking creatures

1317
00:57:23,990 --> 00:57:21,680
was then mimicked according to my source

1318
00:57:26,390 --> 00:57:24,000
by the us government because

1319
00:57:28,710 --> 00:57:26,400
what the soviets did we needed to do

1320
00:57:30,789 --> 00:57:28,720
that is what the cold war was about they

1321
00:57:34,309 --> 00:57:30,799
could not be ahead of us and according

1322
00:57:35,910 --> 00:57:34,319
to my source he participated in this

1323
00:57:37,510 --> 00:57:35,920
now

1324
00:57:41,349 --> 00:57:37,520
this is a

1325
00:57:43,589 --> 00:57:41,359
enormous burden to unload and

1326
00:57:46,630 --> 00:57:43,599
remember i'm talking about

1327
00:57:48,470 --> 00:57:46,640
having met his family

1328
00:57:53,510 --> 00:57:48,480
and

1329
00:57:54,390 --> 00:57:53,520
he was telling me all this they did not

1330
00:57:57,109 --> 00:57:54,400
know that

1331
00:57:58,789 --> 00:57:57,119
and knowing that when

1332
00:58:00,630 --> 00:57:58,799
he gave me the permission to publish the

1333
00:58:03,510 --> 00:58:00,640
information they would know it was him

1334
00:58:05,750 --> 00:58:03,520
as they did right and i find it

1335
00:58:07,510 --> 00:58:05,760
interesting that in all the

1336
00:58:09,349 --> 00:58:07,520
you know

1337
00:58:10,950 --> 00:58:09,359
the sort of controversy that it

1338
00:58:13,589 --> 00:58:10,960
allegedly created

1339
00:58:15,270 --> 00:58:13,599
very few people were able to and and

1340
00:58:17,109 --> 00:58:15,280
perhaps i can't fault anyone because of

1341
00:58:18,710 --> 00:58:17,119
course when you're the reporter you know

1342
00:58:21,349 --> 00:58:18,720
the source and to everybody else it's

1343
00:58:23,750 --> 00:58:21,359
just a story now whether you know

1344
00:58:26,069 --> 00:58:23,760
literally or and figuratively but this

1345
00:58:28,069 --> 00:58:26,079
is a real person with a real family and

1346
00:58:30,470 --> 00:58:28,079
you know him i sat there after the book

1347
00:58:32,950 --> 00:58:30,480
published with his family

1348
00:58:34,470 --> 00:58:32,960
you know saying how could you how could

1349
00:58:37,349 --> 00:58:34,480
you say this how could you have done

1350
00:58:38,630 --> 00:58:37,359
this i mean it's a and so to answer your

1351
00:58:39,670 --> 00:58:38,640
question

1352
00:58:41,829 --> 00:58:39,680
you know

1353
00:58:43,510 --> 00:58:41,839
doing anything that

1354
00:58:46,069 --> 00:58:43,520
is linked to

1355
00:58:49,430 --> 00:58:46,079
science pseudoscience

1356
00:58:51,349 --> 00:58:49,440
horror science that involves the evil

1357
00:58:54,870 --> 00:58:51,359
doctor angela is

1358
00:58:57,270 --> 00:58:54,880
you know is is a is a giant

1359
00:58:59,990 --> 00:58:57,280
uh dark-hearted affair it's a it's it's

1360
00:59:01,670 --> 00:59:00,000
about as taboo as it gets

1361
00:59:03,910 --> 00:59:01,680
you know you really

1362
00:59:06,069 --> 00:59:03,920
it bothers everybody bothers me and

1363
00:59:08,630 --> 00:59:06,079
nobody likes to even think about it

1364
00:59:11,190 --> 00:59:08,640
it's something that happened were

1365
00:59:14,069 --> 00:59:11,200
you know embarrassed as human beings to

1366
00:59:16,069 --> 00:59:14,079
know that we could go there but it is

1367
00:59:18,789 --> 00:59:16,079
like i said it's just taboo we'd rather

1368
00:59:22,230 --> 00:59:18,799
not talk about it or rather not think

1369
00:59:23,670 --> 00:59:22,240
about it and then of course when you

1370
00:59:26,950 --> 00:59:23,680
you're in front of a

1371
00:59:28,230 --> 00:59:26,960
crowd of ufo uh

1372
00:59:31,829 --> 00:59:28,240
believers

1373
00:59:34,390 --> 00:59:31,839
and contactees and witnesses and then

1374
00:59:36,069 --> 00:59:34,400
you discuss this well then you know i'm

1375
00:59:37,510 --> 00:59:36,079
surprised you know you weren't like

1376
00:59:39,109 --> 00:59:37,520
hillary clinton

1377
00:59:41,109 --> 00:59:39,119
dodging a shoe

1378
00:59:43,750 --> 00:59:41,119
because if if you know what i mean

1379
00:59:47,030 --> 00:59:43,760
because yeah that's uh

1380
00:59:49,270 --> 00:59:47,040
it's raining on on on everybody's parade

1381
00:59:50,309 --> 00:59:49,280
and on top of that let me just say this

1382
00:59:53,270 --> 00:59:50,319
when you're

1383
00:59:55,670 --> 00:59:53,280
i mean

1384
00:59:57,430 --> 00:59:55,680
i hope he's not excluding aliens from

1385
00:59:59,829 --> 00:59:57,440
the tv series i mean wouldn't that kind

1386
01:00:02,069 --> 00:59:59,839
of freak everybody out too i don't know

1387
01:00:03,430 --> 01:00:02,079
what i don't think anyone gets excluded

1388
01:00:05,030 --> 01:00:03,440
and i think what's interesting here is

1389
01:00:07,829 --> 01:00:05,040
that remember is that

1390
01:00:12,470 --> 01:00:09,589
there's there's there's room for

1391
01:00:14,309 --> 01:00:12,480
everything i mean i've also had very

1392
01:00:15,430 --> 01:00:14,319
credible people people that i really

1393
01:00:18,789 --> 01:00:15,440
trust

1394
01:00:22,390 --> 01:00:18,799
and that know who my source is

1395
01:00:26,630 --> 01:00:23,990
he was used

1396
01:00:29,430 --> 01:00:26,640
well you know exactly exactly but you

1397
01:00:31,109 --> 01:00:29,440
know and you don't know annie honestly

1398
01:00:32,870 --> 01:00:31,119
when you're in this dark world and

1399
01:00:34,150 --> 01:00:32,880
you're in it you're you're knee-deep

1400
01:00:36,390 --> 01:00:34,160
you're neck deep

1401
01:00:37,510 --> 01:00:36,400
you don't know you know who to believe

1402
01:00:38,390 --> 01:00:37,520
and

1403
01:00:39,270 --> 01:00:38,400
when

1404
01:00:41,349 --> 01:00:39,280
uh

1405
01:00:44,230 --> 01:00:41,359
we were talking before the show but a

1406
01:00:46,390 --> 01:00:44,240
good example of this is richard doty

1407
01:00:48,870 --> 01:00:46,400
and if you ever get a chance watch the

1408
01:00:51,030 --> 01:00:48,880
new documentary it's called miragement

1409
01:00:54,390 --> 01:00:51,040
and when you see what

1410
01:00:55,510 --> 01:00:54,400
what his mission was and how freely the

1411
01:00:56,870 --> 01:00:55,520
government

1412
01:00:58,549 --> 01:00:56,880
uh

1413
01:01:00,950 --> 01:00:58,559
would just

1414
01:01:02,789 --> 01:01:00,960
feed disinformation into somebody for

1415
01:01:04,230 --> 01:01:02,799
their own agenda

1416
01:01:06,710 --> 01:01:04,240
no matter what it is it doesn't matter

1417
01:01:10,470 --> 01:01:06,720
what what the agenda is but in in

1418
01:01:11,510 --> 01:01:10,480
dodie's case it was ufos so

1419
01:01:12,870 --> 01:01:11,520
um

1420
01:01:15,750 --> 01:01:12,880
when

1421
01:01:18,069 --> 01:01:15,760
your source is is as is feeding

1422
01:01:19,190 --> 01:01:18,079
information to you as he believes it

1423
01:01:21,670 --> 01:01:19,200
because

1424
01:01:23,510 --> 01:01:21,680
he's he's not lying do you understand

1425
01:01:24,950 --> 01:01:23,520
what i'm saying so of course

1426
01:01:26,950 --> 01:01:24,960
we're we're on the same page here but

1427
01:01:28,950 --> 01:01:26,960
it's why it's why i don't have to dodge

1428
01:01:31,109 --> 01:01:28,960
the hillary clinton shoe because

1429
01:01:32,789 --> 01:01:31,119
i'm just telling you straight up looking

1430
01:01:35,109 --> 01:01:32,799
you straight in the eyes

1431
01:01:39,349 --> 01:01:35,119
from my book same as i'm talking here

1432
01:01:41,190 --> 01:01:39,359
now here this is exactly what i was told

1433
01:01:43,109 --> 01:01:41,200
and here's why

1434
01:01:45,349 --> 01:01:43,119
i believe you know i i don't want to say

1435
01:01:47,750 --> 01:01:45,359
believe it but why i believe the

1436
01:01:49,030 --> 01:01:47,760
legitimacy of this person speaking in

1437
01:01:51,030 --> 01:01:49,040
other words

1438
01:01:52,390 --> 01:01:51,040
you know that's very different than

1439
01:01:54,069 --> 01:01:52,400
somebody you meet on the street and

1440
01:01:55,670 --> 01:01:54,079
tells you a story

1441
01:01:57,030 --> 01:01:55,680
you you would really want if you spend

1442
01:01:58,950 --> 01:01:57,040
two years with that person you're going

1443
01:02:01,109 --> 01:01:58,960
to make the decision whether or not you

1444
01:02:01,910 --> 01:02:01,119
want to present that story right right

1445
01:02:02,870 --> 01:02:01,920
right

1446
01:02:05,990 --> 01:02:02,880
well

1447
01:02:08,710 --> 01:02:06,000
like i said chris i can't imagine him

1448
01:02:11,109 --> 01:02:08,720
you know leaving aliens off of the table

1449
01:02:13,030 --> 01:02:11,119
and and certainly you know the beauty of

1450
01:02:14,630 --> 01:02:13,040
it is like i said in the in the

1451
01:02:16,309 --> 01:02:14,640
beginning

1452
01:02:18,789 --> 01:02:16,319
there's nothing

1453
01:02:22,470 --> 01:02:18,799
that would shock him he

1454
01:02:23,750 --> 01:02:22,480
he hey that's a good idea yeah wow yeah

1455
01:02:26,950 --> 01:02:23,760
let's go there

1456
01:02:28,710 --> 01:02:26,960
so i i'm excited about uh i'm like is it

1457
01:02:30,870 --> 01:02:28,720
going to be called area 51 by the way i

1458
01:02:32,470 --> 01:02:30,880
know that i've read that a few times so

1459
01:02:33,589 --> 01:02:32,480
they're just sticking to it i cannot

1460
01:02:34,470 --> 01:02:33,599
wait now

1461
01:02:36,789 --> 01:02:34,480
is

1462
01:02:38,390 --> 01:02:36,799
now i know it's in production now before

1463
01:02:40,710 --> 01:02:38,400
we start to move on a little bit i know

1464
01:02:42,630 --> 01:02:40,720
it's in production now do they have a

1465
01:02:45,430 --> 01:02:42,640
is it going to be in the fall schedule

1466
01:02:48,950 --> 01:02:45,440
is it going to be in 2014

1467
01:02:50,230 --> 01:02:48,960
you know that is always up to amc right

1468
01:02:52,710 --> 01:02:50,240
i would just say

1469
01:02:55,030 --> 01:02:52,720
stay tuned and be excited because i mean

1470
01:02:56,630 --> 01:02:55,040
i i you know i am but i love everything

1471
01:02:58,630 --> 01:02:56,640
that you said about

1472
01:03:00,549 --> 01:02:58,640
about this um

1473
01:03:02,069 --> 01:03:00,559
this idea that anything is possible when

1474
01:03:04,230 --> 01:03:02,079
you're in the hands of a master

1475
01:03:06,710 --> 01:03:04,240
storyteller like chris carter and i

1476
01:03:09,670 --> 01:03:06,720
think that that also comes from his real

1477
01:03:13,270 --> 01:03:09,680
deep core beliefs of that nothing is

1478
01:03:15,430 --> 01:03:13,280
what it seems but yet he's got the

1479
01:03:17,270 --> 01:03:15,440
the puppet master control of the story

1480
01:03:18,870 --> 01:03:17,280
which is what you want because you want

1481
01:03:20,390 --> 01:03:18,880
to be taken somewhere

1482
01:03:21,430 --> 01:03:20,400
that's really

1483
01:03:22,549 --> 01:03:21,440
um

1484
01:03:24,470 --> 01:03:22,559
you know

1485
01:03:28,150 --> 01:03:24,480
an enigma

1486
01:03:30,150 --> 01:03:28,160
with uh with area 51 and because it's a

1487
01:03:31,430 --> 01:03:30,160
television series as opposed to a

1488
01:03:33,270 --> 01:03:31,440
feature film

1489
01:03:35,190 --> 01:03:33,280
the writer is

1490
01:03:37,190 --> 01:03:35,200
is involved right now you're you're

1491
01:03:39,270 --> 01:03:37,200
sitting down are you are you there

1492
01:03:41,829 --> 01:03:39,280
writing with them are they consulting

1493
01:03:43,430 --> 01:03:41,839
with you every step of the way or

1494
01:03:45,750 --> 01:03:43,440
do they just have your book on the table

1495
01:03:48,150 --> 01:03:45,760
and they consult the book

1496
01:03:50,150 --> 01:03:48,160
chris is the master of secrets he goes

1497
01:03:51,349 --> 01:03:50,160
away does his magic and then we all get

1498
01:03:53,270 --> 01:03:51,359
together and you know we have lots of

1499
01:03:56,230 --> 01:03:53,280
story meetings and stuff like that but i

1500
01:03:57,270 --> 01:03:56,240
mean he's he's the writer you know he is

1501
01:04:00,230 --> 01:03:57,280
the

1502
01:04:02,309 --> 01:04:00,240
he's really he's in charge and story

1503
01:04:04,630 --> 01:04:02,319
okay this is my next question uh is it a

1504
01:04:06,470 --> 01:04:04,640
period piece is it going to start off in

1505
01:04:17,430 --> 01:04:06,480
1947

1506
01:04:20,950 --> 01:04:19,029
give me a little something well you know

1507
01:04:22,870 --> 01:04:20,960
here's the funny thing is

1508
01:04:24,950 --> 01:04:22,880
in the world of like non-fiction you

1509
01:04:26,549 --> 01:04:24,960
know in journalism and you know you

1510
01:04:28,230 --> 01:04:26,559
really have to keep secrets it's like

1511
01:04:30,390 --> 01:04:28,240
you got to honor your sources but i tell

1512
01:04:32,950 --> 01:04:30,400
you tv is even more secretive

1513
01:04:35,109 --> 01:04:32,960
yeah totally totally and you know well

1514
01:04:37,029 --> 01:04:35,119
and the thing is when it comes to chris

1515
01:04:40,710 --> 01:04:37,039
and this is why i'm so excited about

1516
01:04:43,109 --> 01:04:40,720
about area 51 is that uh

1517
01:04:45,430 --> 01:04:43,119
he the way that he did x-files and the

1518
01:04:48,470 --> 01:04:45,440
way that he dealt with

1519
01:04:51,670 --> 01:04:48,480
uh that story just the basic storyline

1520
01:04:52,710 --> 01:04:51,680
over the years um you know that he's not

1521
01:04:53,510 --> 01:04:52,720
scared

1522
01:04:58,150 --> 01:04:53,520
and

1523
01:04:59,109 --> 01:04:58,160
x-files he can do whatever the freak he

1524
01:05:01,510 --> 01:04:59,119
wants

1525
01:05:05,029 --> 01:05:01,520
and there's nobody that's going to tell

1526
01:05:06,870 --> 01:05:05,039
him no because they can't and that's why

1527
01:05:09,190 --> 01:05:06,880
this is going to be great and the book

1528
01:05:10,630 --> 01:05:09,200
is good the you know he's good the

1529
01:05:12,230 --> 01:05:10,640
staff's going to be good so you know

1530
01:05:14,230 --> 01:05:12,240
it's going to be great i can't i can't

1531
01:05:17,029 --> 01:05:14,240
wait i i really can't

1532
01:05:19,270 --> 01:05:17,039
it's something to look forward to okay

1533
01:05:21,029 --> 01:05:19,280
operation paperclip

1534
01:05:22,549 --> 01:05:21,039
now

1535
01:05:24,150 --> 01:05:22,559
how is it doing by the way how are the

1536
01:05:25,750 --> 01:05:24,160
sales

1537
01:05:27,109 --> 01:05:25,760
oh my god it's great i mean you know

1538
01:05:29,430 --> 01:05:27,119
went right to the new york times

1539
01:05:32,470 --> 01:05:29,440
bestseller list and and here's the thing

1540
01:05:34,549 --> 01:05:32,480
when you're uh an author you just

1541
01:05:37,670 --> 01:05:34,559
you just do at least for me

1542
01:05:39,750 --> 01:05:37,680
i just find stories that i really want

1543
01:05:41,670 --> 01:05:39,760
to know about i think i once heard it

1544
01:05:43,190 --> 01:05:41,680
said best when another writer was saying

1545
01:05:45,109 --> 01:05:43,200
there's two kinds of writers in this

1546
01:05:47,109 --> 01:05:45,119
world there's people who write about

1547
01:05:48,549 --> 01:05:47,119
what they know

1548
01:05:51,829 --> 01:05:48,559
and there's people who write about what

1549
01:05:53,670 --> 01:05:51,839
they don't know and i fall into that cat

1550
01:05:55,510 --> 01:05:53,680
the second category and this is of

1551
01:05:57,829 --> 01:05:55,520
course starting out you know you just if

1552
01:05:58,789 --> 01:05:57,839
you don't know a subject but you want to

1553
01:06:01,270 --> 01:05:58,799
know

1554
01:06:03,589 --> 01:06:01,280
then it becomes a really compelling

1555
01:06:05,029 --> 01:06:03,599
investigation and by the time that

1556
01:06:06,870 --> 01:06:05,039
you're that you're that i'm done

1557
01:06:08,150 --> 01:06:06,880
researching and reporting it

1558
01:06:10,230 --> 01:06:08,160
i know

1559
01:06:11,910 --> 01:06:10,240
what i and then i i can tell you but

1560
01:06:13,270 --> 01:06:11,920
here's how operation paper club started

1561
01:06:15,029 --> 01:06:13,280
for me it was actually i was researching

1562
01:06:16,069 --> 01:06:15,039
area 51

1563
01:06:18,470 --> 01:06:16,079
and i was

1564
01:06:20,470 --> 01:06:18,480
learning about the horton brothers

1565
01:06:22,230 --> 01:06:20,480
and you know the the with the flying

1566
01:06:23,270 --> 01:06:22,240
wing that we just spoke about

1567
01:06:24,789 --> 01:06:23,280
and i

1568
01:06:27,029 --> 01:06:24,799
learned that the horton brothers were

1569
01:06:29,109 --> 01:06:27,039
passed up for operation paper clip from

1570
01:06:30,309 --> 01:06:29,119
all that documentation i was telling you

1571
01:06:31,270 --> 01:06:30,319
about

1572
01:06:33,430 --> 01:06:31,280
and

1573
01:06:35,109 --> 01:06:33,440
i said to myself

1574
01:06:37,510 --> 01:06:35,119
fascinating operation paper clip i don't

1575
01:06:39,510 --> 01:06:37,520
know anything about this and so

1576
01:06:42,069 --> 01:06:39,520
what i did learn was that they had a

1577
01:06:45,430 --> 01:06:42,079
boss and the boss's name was colonel

1578
01:06:48,069 --> 01:06:45,440
siegfried nehemiah and canaya meyer came

1579
01:06:49,349 --> 01:06:48,079
to america on operation paperclip and i

1580
01:06:51,589 --> 01:06:49,359
looked him up this was still doing the

1581
01:06:54,309 --> 01:06:51,599
area 51 research and i was fascinated to

1582
01:06:56,630 --> 01:06:54,319
learn that nehemiah was this incredibly

1583
01:06:58,710 --> 01:06:56,640
important pilot he was a spy pilot for

1584
01:07:00,630 --> 01:06:58,720
the third reich but he was also a really

1585
01:07:02,309 --> 01:07:00,640
talented engineer

1586
01:07:05,990 --> 01:07:02,319
and he was so

1587
01:07:08,309 --> 01:07:06,000
enamored by herman goring who ran the

1588
01:07:10,309 --> 01:07:08,319
luftwaffe that goring eventually made

1589
01:07:12,309 --> 01:07:10,319
him head of all technical developments

1590
01:07:14,710 --> 01:07:12,319
for the luftwaffe which is how he became

1591
01:07:17,589 --> 01:07:14,720
the boss to the horton brothers

1592
01:07:21,109 --> 01:07:17,599
the on a personal level hermann goring

1593
01:07:24,470 --> 01:07:21,119
liked colonel siegfried nehemiah so much

1594
01:07:25,990 --> 01:07:24,480
that he called him my boy

1595
01:07:27,270 --> 01:07:26,000
then i learned

1596
01:07:29,589 --> 01:07:27,280
that

1597
01:07:31,190 --> 01:07:29,599
nehemiah came to the united states as

1598
01:07:33,910 --> 01:07:31,200
part of operation paper clip with his

1599
01:07:35,190 --> 01:07:33,920
seven children and his wife he lived in

1600
01:07:37,510 --> 01:07:35,200
wright-patterson he worked at

1601
01:07:40,470 --> 01:07:37,520
wright-patterson he lived there in ohio

1602
01:07:42,950 --> 01:07:40,480
and when he retired in the mid-70s

1603
01:07:46,309 --> 01:07:42,960
the department of defense gave him an

1604
01:07:49,270 --> 01:07:46,319
award called the distinguished civilian

1605
01:07:52,789 --> 01:07:49,280
service award that is the highest award

1606
01:07:54,710 --> 01:07:52,799
that the pentagon can give a scientist

1607
01:07:57,430 --> 01:07:54,720
and i thought to myself

1608
01:07:59,829 --> 01:07:57,440
how on earth do you go from being the

1609
01:08:02,390 --> 01:07:59,839
most important guy to hermon goring in

1610
01:08:04,390 --> 01:08:02,400
the luftwaffe to being one of the most

1611
01:08:07,029 --> 01:08:04,400
important scientists to the department

1612
01:08:09,190 --> 01:08:07,039
of defense and i didn't know that answer

1613
01:08:11,430 --> 01:08:09,200
and i wanted to know that answer and

1614
01:08:14,789 --> 01:08:11,440
that's how i began researching paperclip

1615
01:08:17,349 --> 01:08:14,799
for for everybody myself included when

1616
01:08:19,430 --> 01:08:17,359
you first hear about you get a whiff you

1617
01:08:22,309 --> 01:08:19,440
know a little whiff of operation

1618
01:08:23,590 --> 01:08:22,319
paperclip your first thought is you know

1619
01:08:26,309 --> 01:08:23,600
this is bs

1620
01:08:28,709 --> 01:08:26,319
it's it there's just no way

1621
01:08:31,030 --> 01:08:28,719
i'm not i'm not buying into it

1622
01:08:34,870 --> 01:08:31,040
but then you find out that it's real and

1623
01:08:36,950 --> 01:08:34,880
as you start to read and and investigate

1624
01:08:39,349 --> 01:08:36,960
and you find out how far and how deep

1625
01:08:41,269 --> 01:08:39,359
and how wide it was it's it's one of the

1626
01:08:43,910 --> 01:08:41,279
craziest stories

1627
01:08:45,430 --> 01:08:43,920
of the 20th century but by by any

1628
01:08:47,030 --> 01:08:45,440
stretch it doesn't matter what you what

1629
01:08:48,789 --> 01:08:47,040
you want to talk about it's right there

1630
01:08:50,870 --> 01:08:48,799
but for those that don't know what what

1631
01:08:52,550 --> 01:08:50,880
paper clip is

1632
01:08:54,870 --> 01:08:52,560
let's just that and it's going to be

1633
01:08:56,390 --> 01:08:54,880
very few with this audience our audience

1634
01:08:58,870 --> 01:08:56,400
is very smart but

1635
01:09:00,709 --> 01:08:58,880
um just a quick review what was

1636
01:09:06,390 --> 01:09:00,719
paperclip

1637
01:09:10,070 --> 01:09:06,400
military program that brought sixteen

1638
01:09:11,990 --> 01:09:10,080
hundred nazi scientists to america

1639
01:09:14,309 --> 01:09:12,000
beginning in the months

1640
01:09:15,910 --> 01:09:14,319
weeks really after the surrender

1641
01:09:19,189 --> 01:09:15,920
documents were signed

1642
01:09:23,189 --> 01:09:19,199
um ending world war two in europe

1643
01:09:24,070 --> 01:09:23,199
and it also had a benign public face

1644
01:09:25,829 --> 01:09:24,080
so

1645
01:09:29,349 --> 01:09:25,839
shortly after the scientists started

1646
01:09:32,149 --> 01:09:29,359
arriving the war department issued a

1647
01:09:35,110 --> 01:09:32,159
press release saying we have brought

1648
01:09:36,470 --> 01:09:35,120
over some of the good germans

1649
01:09:39,349 --> 01:09:36,480
and

1650
01:09:41,349 --> 01:09:39,359
you have these two themes going right

1651
01:09:45,669 --> 01:09:41,359
together which is one

1652
01:09:47,749 --> 01:09:45,679
the secrecy of the truth behind what

1653
01:09:50,950 --> 01:09:47,759
those scientists were doing

1654
01:09:52,870 --> 01:09:50,960
and the presentation of them as the

1655
01:09:56,149 --> 01:09:52,880
beneficent scientists

1656
01:09:58,630 --> 01:09:56,159
and that reconciliation between the two

1657
01:10:00,830 --> 01:09:58,640
is what my book operation paper clip is

1658
01:10:04,950 --> 01:10:00,840
all about i profile

1659
01:10:06,950 --> 01:10:04,960
21 of the 1600 uh scientists

1660
01:10:10,149 --> 01:10:06,960
and among them

1661
01:10:12,630 --> 01:10:10,159
there are for example the surgeon

1662
01:10:14,390 --> 01:10:12,640
general of the third reich and as you

1663
01:10:16,630 --> 01:10:14,400
were talking you know a moment ago about

1664
01:10:18,229 --> 01:10:16,640
how you know people really you almost

1665
01:10:18,950 --> 01:10:18,239
can't even believe this it doesn't sound

1666
01:10:21,030 --> 01:10:18,960
true

1667
01:10:23,669 --> 01:10:21,040
i suddenly had this like glimmer of this

1668
01:10:26,310 --> 01:10:23,679
ufo analogy you know how many people

1669
01:10:28,870 --> 01:10:26,320
sort of paw and say oh that's not

1670
01:10:31,510 --> 01:10:28,880
possible but imagine let's just say the

1671
01:10:34,790 --> 01:10:31,520
documents were still classified

1672
01:10:36,790 --> 01:10:34,800
and somebody said at a dinner party

1673
01:10:39,590 --> 01:10:36,800
well you know we brought i hear we

1674
01:10:42,630 --> 01:10:39,600
brought the surgeon general of the third

1675
01:10:45,350 --> 01:10:42,640
reich the man that led many of the

1676
01:10:47,510 --> 01:10:45,360
murderous concentration camp experiments

1677
01:10:50,310 --> 01:10:47,520
we actually brought him over here he was

1678
01:10:52,709 --> 01:10:50,320
at the randolph air force base in texas

1679
01:10:54,470 --> 01:10:52,719
he worked for the u.s air force i mean

1680
01:10:56,390 --> 01:10:54,480
people would kind of push theirs chairs

1681
01:10:59,510 --> 01:10:56,400
back and you know wipe the corners of

1682
01:11:01,669 --> 01:10:59,520
their mouth and say okay i mean it's

1683
01:11:04,950 --> 01:11:01,679
impossible to believe such a thing it's

1684
01:11:06,229 --> 01:11:04,960
a hundred percent true and

1685
01:11:08,790 --> 01:11:06,239
how about

1686
01:11:11,590 --> 01:11:08,800
this is what's fascinating for me is is

1687
01:11:12,630 --> 01:11:11,600
the americans and you know maybe even

1688
01:11:15,270 --> 01:11:12,640
jews

1689
01:11:17,270 --> 01:11:15,280
that were working around them

1690
01:11:19,350 --> 01:11:17,280
that that knew about their history but

1691
01:11:21,030 --> 01:11:19,360
they were forced into

1692
01:11:23,590 --> 01:11:21,040
acceptance

1693
01:11:25,750 --> 01:11:23,600
and as a peer as a peer and maybe even

1694
01:11:27,510 --> 01:11:25,760
as a boss specific you know look at von

1695
01:11:30,149 --> 01:11:27,520
braun you know that's another example of

1696
01:11:32,149 --> 01:11:30,159
that i mean he he headed it all

1697
01:11:33,750 --> 01:11:32,159
and it's it's a shocking

1698
01:11:35,350 --> 01:11:33,760
oh i i wanted to ask you really quick

1699
01:11:37,590 --> 01:11:35,360
before it gets away from me

1700
01:11:40,070 --> 01:11:37,600
right as the war uh

1701
01:11:41,350 --> 01:11:40,080
was coming to an end

1702
01:11:44,070 --> 01:11:41,360
were the

1703
01:11:46,390 --> 01:11:44,080
did we have uh

1704
01:11:48,630 --> 01:11:46,400
specific people going across europe with

1705
01:11:49,990 --> 01:11:48,640
like a a wanted list

1706
01:11:50,950 --> 01:11:50,000
you know looking

1707
01:11:51,910 --> 01:11:50,960
okay

1708
01:11:54,070 --> 01:11:51,920
and

1709
01:11:56,310 --> 01:11:54,080
absolutely but i'm gonna back up for one

1710
01:11:58,390 --> 01:11:56,320
second now the idea about von braun and

1711
01:11:59,270 --> 01:11:58,400
the scientists you know working side by

1712
01:12:01,990 --> 01:11:59,280
side

1713
01:12:04,630 --> 01:12:02,000
many of the area 51 scientists

1714
01:12:07,430 --> 01:12:04,640
worked with german scientists and what

1715
01:12:08,709 --> 01:12:07,440
they told me was oh no no no the guys we

1716
01:12:10,229 --> 01:12:08,719
were working with were the good

1717
01:12:12,709 --> 01:12:10,239
scientists because

1718
01:12:15,189 --> 01:12:12,719
that's what they were told and certainly

1719
01:12:17,590 --> 01:12:15,199
the same with von braun i mean

1720
01:12:19,990 --> 01:12:17,600
you know you if you're told by the per

1721
01:12:21,510 --> 01:12:20,000
the boss that you respect

1722
01:12:23,189 --> 01:12:21,520
oh by the way this is one of the good

1723
01:12:25,350 --> 01:12:23,199
german scientists he was definitely not

1724
01:12:27,430 --> 01:12:25,360
involved in anything of course why would

1725
01:12:28,950 --> 01:12:27,440
you doubt that you you love your country

1726
01:12:31,270 --> 01:12:28,960
you love your government you maybe just

1727
01:12:32,790 --> 01:12:31,280
fought in the war you know your father

1728
01:12:34,790 --> 01:12:32,800
you're not going to doubt that and it

1729
01:12:37,750 --> 01:12:34,800
was it's only

1730
01:12:39,910 --> 01:12:37,760
after the decades pass

1731
01:12:42,149 --> 01:12:39,920
and things are finally declassified in

1732
01:12:44,630 --> 01:12:42,159
the 80s that any of this became apparent

1733
01:12:46,790 --> 01:12:44,640
and now we know a different story

1734
01:12:49,510 --> 01:12:46,800
but you asked about the list yeah what's

1735
01:12:50,870 --> 01:12:49,520
fascinating is that the list began

1736
01:12:52,950 --> 01:12:50,880
warner von brown by the way was number

1737
01:12:54,149 --> 01:12:52,960
one on the list of course

1738
01:12:56,630 --> 01:12:54,159
um

1739
01:12:58,149 --> 01:12:56,640
but very close second was dr walter

1740
01:13:00,870 --> 01:12:58,159
schreiber the surgeon general of the

1741
01:13:03,990 --> 01:13:00,880
third reich and dr kurt bluma the deputy

1742
01:13:07,110 --> 01:13:04,000
surgeon general of the right and dr otto

1743
01:13:09,669 --> 01:13:07,120
ambrose hitler's favorite chemist and so

1744
01:13:11,590 --> 01:13:09,679
on and so forth and this list which

1745
01:13:15,430 --> 01:13:11,600
ultimately became

1746
01:13:17,750 --> 01:13:15,440
known as the osenberg list named after a

1747
01:13:20,070 --> 01:13:17,760
really particularly odious nazi named

1748
01:13:22,709 --> 01:13:20,080
warner osenberg who was a member of the

1749
01:13:24,950 --> 01:13:22,719
gestapo and was also the man in charge

1750
01:13:29,350 --> 01:13:24,960
of compiling this list

1751
01:13:31,669 --> 01:13:29,360
you know was 15 000 scientists long

1752
01:13:33,910 --> 01:13:31,679
and there's a great moment i think in

1753
01:13:35,270 --> 01:13:33,920
operation paper clip that i show where

1754
01:13:38,149 --> 01:13:35,280
because a lot of people wonder how the

1755
01:13:39,669 --> 01:13:38,159
cia fits into this and of course the cia

1756
01:13:41,110 --> 01:13:39,679
did not exist

1757
01:13:43,510 --> 01:13:41,120
at the end of the war it was still the

1758
01:13:46,709 --> 01:13:43,520
oss and oss was in the process of being

1759
01:13:49,350 --> 01:13:46,719
disbanded but paperclip is up and

1760
01:13:51,510 --> 01:13:49,360
running in the united states as i write

1761
01:13:53,510 --> 01:13:51,520
by the time the cia

1762
01:13:55,350 --> 01:13:53,520
is you know comes into existence and one

1763
01:13:57,270 --> 01:13:55,360
of the first things they do and i found

1764
01:13:58,870 --> 01:13:57,280
this documentation in the archives and

1765
01:14:00,390 --> 01:13:58,880
it's incredible you see that you know

1766
01:14:03,189 --> 01:14:00,400
you can kind of read between the lines

1767
01:14:04,790 --> 01:14:03,199
you begin sweating as it says you know

1768
01:14:07,030 --> 01:14:04,800
and i'm paraphrasing here the guy the

1769
01:14:09,510 --> 01:14:07,040
guy the guy in the technical office at

1770
01:14:10,790 --> 01:14:09,520
the cia writes over to the pentagon to

1771
01:14:13,189 --> 01:14:10,800
the joint chiefs of staff who are

1772
01:14:16,390 --> 01:14:13,199
running the program like hey we were

1773
01:14:18,630 --> 01:14:16,400
wondering if we could borrow that list

1774
01:14:21,189 --> 01:14:18,640
and there's sort of this hesitation back

1775
01:14:24,709 --> 01:14:21,199
and forth and then the joy chiefs of

1776
01:14:28,149 --> 01:14:24,719
staff release the list and the cia gets

1777
01:14:29,189 --> 01:14:28,159
hold of this 15 000 person name list

1778
01:14:31,350 --> 01:14:29,199
okay

1779
01:14:33,510 --> 01:14:31,360
and guess what they start doing what

1780
01:14:34,790 --> 01:14:33,520
they start poaching the scientists for

1781
01:14:37,830 --> 01:14:34,800
themselves

1782
01:14:40,070 --> 01:14:37,840
and so there becomes another tug of war

1783
01:14:43,030 --> 01:14:40,080
which is between the pentagon and the

1784
01:14:45,430 --> 01:14:43,040
cia the cia wants to use these

1785
01:14:47,830 --> 01:14:45,440
scientists who are still left behind in

1786
01:14:49,510 --> 01:14:47,840
germany as spies

1787
01:14:51,110 --> 01:14:49,520
and the pentagon wants them as

1788
01:14:53,350 --> 01:14:51,120
scientists

1789
01:14:55,270 --> 01:14:53,360
with uh and what was the choice that's

1790
01:14:58,390 --> 01:14:55,280
the thing what choice did we have if we

1791
01:15:00,950 --> 01:14:58,400
didn't do operation paperclip that means

1792
01:15:02,149 --> 01:15:00,960
everything goes east

1793
01:15:09,750 --> 01:15:02,159
and

1794
01:15:10,709 --> 01:15:09,760
real drama in

1795
01:15:21,950 --> 01:15:10,719
the

1796
01:15:25,430 --> 01:15:21,960
remember this is like

1797
01:15:27,830 --> 01:15:25,440
1946 and they're being advised you know

1798
01:15:30,229 --> 01:15:27,840
the cold war starting immediately after

1799
01:15:31,990 --> 01:15:30,239
the war and the joint chiefs are being

1800
01:15:34,470 --> 01:15:32,000
advised by what was then called the

1801
01:15:36,229 --> 01:15:34,480
joint intelligence committee you know

1802
01:15:39,510 --> 01:15:36,239
saying and again i'm paraphrasing but

1803
01:15:40,709 --> 01:15:39,520
it's pretty close you must we must

1804
01:15:43,189 --> 01:15:40,719
prepare

1805
01:15:45,510 --> 01:15:43,199
for total war

1806
01:15:54,790 --> 01:15:45,520
with the soviet union and they even call

1807
01:16:00,229 --> 01:15:57,990
and chemical weapons and they even set a

1808
01:16:01,990 --> 01:16:00,239
date the joint uh intelligence committee

1809
01:16:04,310 --> 01:16:02,000
tells the joint chiefs of staff the

1810
01:16:07,510 --> 01:16:04,320
soviets are going to be ready to do this

1811
01:16:09,510 --> 01:16:07,520
in 1952 they will have built back up

1812
01:16:20,790 --> 01:16:09,520
from the devastation of world war ii in

1813
01:16:26,630 --> 01:16:24,229
favorite scientist i give up if we don't

1814
01:16:28,790 --> 01:16:26,640
it's so okay you know let's keep going

1815
01:16:30,870 --> 01:16:28,800
you it clipped out again and i don't

1816
01:16:33,110 --> 01:16:30,880
under understand what's doing it it's

1817
01:16:34,390 --> 01:16:33,120
absolutely fantastic you know what hold

1818
01:16:36,709 --> 01:16:34,400
on i'm going to try something just stay

1819
01:16:40,550 --> 01:16:36,719
with me stay with me stay with me stay

1820
01:16:46,070 --> 01:16:40,560
with me stay with me stay with me

1821
01:16:47,110 --> 01:16:46,080
are you there

1822
01:16:49,189 --> 01:16:47,120
okay

1823
01:16:51,510 --> 01:16:49,199
all right i'm gonna

1824
01:16:53,430 --> 01:16:51,520
i just changed channels and i'm

1825
01:16:55,030 --> 01:16:53,440
compressing and

1826
01:16:56,070 --> 01:16:55,040
let's see if that makes a difference

1827
01:16:57,669 --> 01:16:56,080
okay

1828
01:16:58,630 --> 01:16:57,679
all right and you can hear me just fine

1829
01:17:00,310 --> 01:16:58,640
right

1830
01:17:02,630 --> 01:17:00,320
i think i know what it is whenever i say

1831
01:17:05,030 --> 01:17:02,640
the pentagon like an alarm must go off

1832
01:17:07,430 --> 01:17:05,040
it's funny i i was noticing the same

1833
01:17:10,470 --> 01:17:07,440
thing i was noticing the exact same

1834
01:17:12,790 --> 01:17:10,480
thing pentagon is the key word there

1835
01:17:16,070 --> 01:17:12,800
um with um i want to go over to the

1836
01:17:17,830 --> 01:17:16,080
gallery really quick um now you with the

1837
01:17:21,189 --> 01:17:17,840
with the four pictures that are uh with

1838
01:17:23,669 --> 01:17:21,199
paperclip but you bring up schreiber

1839
01:17:25,910 --> 01:17:23,679
and i want everybody i've i i know

1840
01:17:26,709 --> 01:17:25,920
nothing about schreiber

1841
01:17:29,510 --> 01:17:26,719
so

1842
01:17:30,990 --> 01:17:29,520
i'm opening up everybody just go to uh

1843
01:17:32,550 --> 01:17:31,000
everybody listening right now go to

1844
01:17:35,430 --> 01:17:32,560
jimmychurchradio.com go down to the

1845
01:17:37,110 --> 01:17:35,440
gallery he is picture number four in the

1846
01:17:38,229 --> 01:17:37,120
top row

1847
01:17:40,470 --> 01:17:38,239
uh

1848
01:17:44,149 --> 01:17:40,480
kind of a creepy looking guy if you ask

1849
01:17:46,790 --> 01:17:44,159
me but okay so tell me again tell us all

1850
01:17:50,390 --> 01:17:46,800
who was schreiber

1851
01:17:52,709 --> 01:17:50,400
so major gener major general dr walter

1852
01:17:54,390 --> 01:17:52,719
schreiber he was the surgeon general of

1853
01:17:55,590 --> 01:17:54,400
the third reich

1854
01:17:58,870 --> 01:17:55,600
um

1855
01:18:01,669 --> 01:17:58,880
he was in charge of vaccines now that

1856
01:18:04,390 --> 01:18:01,679
may sound slightly benign

1857
01:18:07,990 --> 01:18:04,400
but what vaccines were

1858
01:18:10,550 --> 01:18:08,000
were vaccines against to protect german

1859
01:18:12,870 --> 01:18:10,560
soldiers against biological weapons

1860
01:18:15,750 --> 01:18:12,880
so the deputy surgeon general of the

1861
01:18:17,189 --> 01:18:15,760
reich dr kurt bloma who was tried at

1862
01:18:18,709 --> 01:18:17,199
nuremberg

1863
01:18:20,470 --> 01:18:18,719
and but and both of these men became

1864
01:18:23,910 --> 01:18:20,480
part of paper by the way so

1865
01:18:27,110 --> 01:18:23,920
blumat was in charge of creating for the

1866
01:18:28,870 --> 01:18:27,120
reich a bubonic plague weapon now again

1867
01:18:32,470 --> 01:18:28,880
this is something that really sounds

1868
01:18:35,189 --> 01:18:32,480
made up the documentation is all there

1869
01:18:36,470 --> 01:18:35,199
um bummer was working on the

1870
01:18:39,030 --> 01:18:36,480
leg weapon

1871
01:18:41,189 --> 01:18:39,040
and schreiber and his team were tasked

1872
01:18:43,669 --> 01:18:41,199
with working on a vaccine

1873
01:18:46,229 --> 01:18:43,679
for bubonic plague weapon and also all

1874
01:18:48,630 --> 01:18:46,239
kinds of other vaccines for these you

1875
01:18:51,590 --> 01:18:48,640
know epidemics that were plaguing uh

1876
01:18:52,630 --> 01:18:51,600
germany from typhus to reinderpest

1877
01:18:54,630 --> 01:18:52,640
and

1878
01:18:56,630 --> 01:18:54,640
so

1879
01:18:59,590 --> 01:18:56,640
schreiber was in charge of this program

1880
01:19:02,870 --> 01:18:59,600
and they were using concentration camp

1881
01:19:05,350 --> 01:19:02,880
prisoners to experiment on because you

1882
01:19:08,630 --> 01:19:05,360
know imagine the science

1883
01:19:11,590 --> 01:19:08,640
testing vaccines on mice pushes the

1884
01:19:14,310 --> 01:19:11,600
science pretty slowly and methodically

1885
01:19:16,709 --> 01:19:14,320
and if you can test it on humans

1886
01:19:18,790 --> 01:19:16,719
you're going to get results much much

1887
01:19:20,630 --> 01:19:18,800
faster you're also going to kill a lot

1888
01:19:23,270 --> 01:19:20,640
of people which is exactly what the

1889
01:19:25,030 --> 01:19:23,280
reich was doing and so both of these men

1890
01:19:27,270 --> 01:19:25,040
were involved in really sinister

1891
01:19:29,110 --> 01:19:27,280
dark-hearted programs and the fact that

1892
01:19:32,310 --> 01:19:29,120
they both became part of operation

1893
01:19:33,669 --> 01:19:32,320
paperclip is just really hard to wrap

1894
01:19:35,910 --> 01:19:33,679
the mind around

1895
01:19:37,510 --> 01:19:35,920
i tell their stories you know

1896
01:19:39,669 --> 01:19:37,520
specifically

1897
01:19:43,110 --> 01:19:39,679
and methodically using the different

1898
01:19:44,870 --> 01:19:43,120
documentation that i found both you know

1899
01:19:47,590 --> 01:19:44,880
in german archives in the national

1900
01:19:49,350 --> 01:19:47,600
archives i interviewed dr bloma's family

1901
01:19:53,110 --> 01:19:49,360
members

1902
01:19:55,270 --> 01:19:53,120
you know really tried to bring to life

1903
01:19:59,750 --> 01:19:55,280
the idea that

1904
01:20:03,590 --> 01:19:59,760
the this was a extremely complicated

1905
01:20:05,189 --> 01:20:03,600
tale and involved great moral compromise

1906
01:20:06,630 --> 01:20:05,199
what happened to him

1907
01:20:08,550 --> 01:20:06,640
ultimately

1908
01:20:11,270 --> 01:20:08,560
obviously he was never prosecuted he

1909
01:20:13,590 --> 01:20:11,280
just worked for us um what did he do for

1910
01:20:15,990 --> 01:20:13,600
us but did he head up our chemical

1911
01:20:18,390 --> 01:20:16,000
warfare program over here

1912
01:20:20,550 --> 01:20:18,400
i mean this the schreiber bluma story is

1913
01:20:23,189 --> 01:20:20,560
so crazy because they they were at odds

1914
01:20:25,110 --> 01:20:23,199
with one another their whole careers

1915
01:20:26,470 --> 01:20:25,120
working at the reich they hated each

1916
01:20:28,950 --> 01:20:26,480
other they were they competed with each

1917
01:20:31,430 --> 01:20:28,960
other and then they fought with one

1918
01:20:33,270 --> 01:20:31,440
another you know from a distance through

1919
01:20:35,270 --> 01:20:33,280
the u.s army

1920
01:20:37,270 --> 01:20:35,280
for another decade after the war and the

1921
01:20:39,270 --> 01:20:37,280
reason is this

1922
01:20:41,750 --> 01:20:39,280
schreiber was actually captured by the

1923
01:20:44,870 --> 01:20:41,760
soviets as berlin fell

1924
01:20:46,709 --> 01:20:44,880
he had set up according to him he had

1925
01:20:48,950 --> 01:20:46,719
set up a hospital

1926
01:20:53,110 --> 01:20:48,960
in an underground tunnel near hitler's

1927
01:20:54,950 --> 01:20:53,120
bunker and he was operating on soldiers

1928
01:20:57,990 --> 01:20:54,960
you know german soldiers and and then

1929
01:21:00,550 --> 01:20:58,000
ultimately the soviets took over berlin

1930
01:21:03,270 --> 01:21:00,560
schreiber was captured and he was sent

1931
01:21:05,910 --> 01:21:03,280
off to the soviet union where he

1932
01:21:08,310 --> 01:21:05,920
remained a prisoner for several years

1933
01:21:10,790 --> 01:21:08,320
at the nuremberg trials the trials of

1934
01:21:13,510 --> 01:21:10,800
the major war criminals

1935
01:21:15,750 --> 01:21:13,520
a surprise witness shows up for the

1936
01:21:17,110 --> 01:21:15,760
soviets they don't tell the soviets at

1937
01:21:19,510 --> 01:21:17,120
that point we were still partners with

1938
01:21:21,830 --> 01:21:19,520
them prosecuting the major nazi war

1939
01:21:24,070 --> 01:21:21,840
criminals and the soviets are supposed

1940
01:21:26,950 --> 01:21:24,080
to tell the the allies who their

1941
01:21:28,149 --> 01:21:26,960
witnesses are they don't tell anyone but

1942
01:21:30,070 --> 01:21:28,159
at the last minute say oh we have a

1943
01:21:32,070 --> 01:21:30,080
surprise witness and here he is the

1944
01:21:34,630 --> 01:21:32,080
surgeon general of the third reich and

1945
01:21:38,550 --> 01:21:34,640
they parade out dr walter schreiber who

1946
01:21:40,950 --> 01:21:38,560
testifies against the nazi high command

1947
01:21:43,110 --> 01:21:40,960
for all of this biological weapons

1948
01:21:44,550 --> 01:21:43,120
programs that they had okay

1949
01:21:46,310 --> 01:21:44,560
and everyone was incensed on the

1950
01:21:48,149 --> 01:21:46,320
american side like wait a minute we

1951
01:21:49,510 --> 01:21:48,159
wanted to prosecute this guy what is he

1952
01:21:52,149 --> 01:21:49,520
doing in your hands and it's this

1953
01:21:54,070 --> 01:21:52,159
incredible drama that sort of lost his

1954
01:21:57,510 --> 01:21:54,080
and then schreiber disappears back into

1955
01:21:59,270 --> 01:21:57,520
the soviet union and when he re-emerges

1956
01:22:02,149 --> 01:21:59,280
several years later

1957
01:22:05,030 --> 01:22:02,159
he claims to have defected it's so

1958
01:22:05,910 --> 01:22:05,040
suspicious i mean how could this major

1959
01:22:08,470 --> 01:22:05,920
fish

1960
01:22:10,790 --> 01:22:08,480
right defect right so the suggestion is

1961
01:22:13,189 --> 01:22:10,800
at least my read on the document and

1962
01:22:15,510 --> 01:22:13,199
again i used all these cic counter

1963
01:22:17,590 --> 01:22:15,520
intelligence core documents to show

1964
01:22:19,830 --> 01:22:17,600
the the us you know military

1965
01:22:22,629 --> 01:22:19,840
intelligence in u.s occupied germany at

1966
01:22:24,070 --> 01:22:22,639
this point deciding is he a spy is he

1967
01:22:26,390 --> 01:22:24,080
not where and they just say you know

1968
01:22:29,350 --> 01:22:26,400
what either way let's get him

1969
01:22:31,189 --> 01:22:29,360
they get him he's too hot of a potato

1970
01:22:33,590 --> 01:22:31,199
that's what they call him to actually

1971
01:22:36,790 --> 01:22:33,600
bring him to the united states so they

1972
01:22:38,470 --> 01:22:36,800
set him up in a facility in germany

1973
01:22:41,110 --> 01:22:38,480
which i write about in in operation

1974
01:22:44,550 --> 01:22:41,120
paper clip the book this facility called

1975
01:22:46,390 --> 01:22:44,560
camp king almost unknown to most people

1976
01:22:48,470 --> 01:22:46,400
that we had a

1977
01:22:50,629 --> 01:22:48,480
secret facility outside of heidelberg

1978
01:22:53,110 --> 01:22:50,639
where we were interrogating people and

1979
01:22:54,070 --> 01:22:53,120
this is where the mk ultra experiments

1980
01:22:56,229 --> 01:22:54,080
began

1981
01:22:59,030 --> 01:22:56,239
and who was the surgeon

1982
01:23:00,790 --> 01:22:59,040
in charge of that post that secret

1983
01:23:02,390 --> 01:23:00,800
wasn't it was like partially secret

1984
01:23:04,709 --> 01:23:02,400
partially classified

1985
01:23:07,189 --> 01:23:04,719
camp king existed but this part of it

1986
01:23:10,870 --> 01:23:07,199
didn't until these documents showed up

1987
01:23:13,709 --> 01:23:10,880
but dr schreiber was the post doctor and

1988
01:23:15,270 --> 01:23:13,719
at that facility we were now

1989
01:23:18,470 --> 01:23:15,280
interrogating

1990
01:23:21,350 --> 01:23:18,480
soviet bloc prisoners we had captured

1991
01:23:23,350 --> 01:23:21,360
and dr schreiber was the post surgeon

1992
01:23:26,470 --> 01:23:23,360
and then ultimately

1993
01:23:28,229 --> 01:23:26,480
war with korea breaks out suddenly the

1994
01:23:30,950 --> 01:23:28,239
decision is made you know what the

1995
01:23:33,189 --> 01:23:30,960
communists are so coming at us

1996
01:23:36,149 --> 01:23:33,199
never mind that this guy's

1997
01:23:37,910 --> 01:23:36,159
too much of a hot potato to bring him to

1998
01:23:39,590 --> 01:23:37,920
america and they bring him to america

1999
01:23:42,709 --> 01:23:39,600
and that's how he wound up

2000
01:23:45,590 --> 01:23:42,719
at the randolph air force base in texas

2001
01:23:48,070 --> 01:23:45,600
unbelievable and and and next you're

2002
01:23:50,229 --> 01:23:48,080
going to tell me that uh

2003
01:23:51,430 --> 01:23:50,239
he had a pension and a retirement plan

2004
01:23:53,590 --> 01:23:51,440
too

2005
01:23:55,430 --> 01:23:53,600
you know even worse he brought his

2006
01:23:57,750 --> 01:23:55,440
mother-in-law

2007
01:23:59,990 --> 01:23:57,760
and his wife and his son and he settled

2008
01:24:01,750 --> 01:24:00,000
in san antonio texas

2009
01:24:03,590 --> 01:24:01,760
did he change his name did he change his

2010
01:24:05,189 --> 01:24:03,600
name did no

2011
01:24:07,350 --> 01:24:05,199
this is what's so crazy but remember

2012
01:24:09,750 --> 01:24:07,360
this is of course before the days you

2013
01:24:11,590 --> 01:24:09,760
know of the internet and the days of the

2014
01:24:14,550 --> 01:24:11,600
dark matter radio show where people

2015
01:24:16,390 --> 01:24:14,560
actually were could be incensed um right

2016
01:24:17,310 --> 01:24:16,400
you know this was back in

2017
01:24:19,510 --> 01:24:17,320
in

2018
01:24:22,870 --> 01:24:19,520
1951 and

2019
01:24:23,830 --> 01:24:22,880
people really towed the party line

2020
01:24:26,229 --> 01:24:23,840
but

2021
01:24:28,950 --> 01:24:26,239
the downfall of dr

2022
01:24:31,510 --> 01:24:28,960
schreiber was hubris and that is because

2023
01:24:35,270 --> 01:24:31,520
he gave an interview i mean can you

2024
01:24:37,270 --> 01:24:35,280
believe this he gave an interview

2025
01:24:39,669 --> 01:24:37,280
and said here i am in america working

2026
01:24:42,149 --> 01:24:39,679
for the u.s air force and lo and behold

2027
01:24:44,629 --> 01:24:42,159
i love it when fate and coincidence come

2028
01:24:45,910 --> 01:24:44,639
into a real you know a story in a manner

2029
01:24:47,669 --> 01:24:45,920
that is just

2030
01:24:48,550 --> 01:24:47,679
astonishing it's almost too good to be

2031
01:24:51,189 --> 01:24:48,560
true

2032
01:24:52,550 --> 01:24:51,199
one of the prosecutors at the doctor's

2033
01:24:54,229 --> 01:24:52,560
trial

2034
01:24:57,910 --> 01:24:54,239
i think really one of the heroes of my

2035
01:24:59,350 --> 01:24:57,920
book dr leopold alexander who had tried

2036
01:25:01,189 --> 01:24:59,360
to interview schreiber when he was

2037
01:25:03,669 --> 01:25:01,199
testifying against the nazi high command

2038
01:25:05,350 --> 01:25:03,679
at nuremberg because he knew dr

2039
01:25:07,110 --> 01:25:05,360
alexander knew schreiber was a wanted

2040
01:25:10,390 --> 01:25:07,120
war criminal

2041
01:25:13,350 --> 01:25:10,400
and schreiber read this in a magazine

2042
01:25:15,430 --> 01:25:13,360
and said this is crazy you do know who

2043
01:25:16,709 --> 01:25:15,440
this guy is and then i don't want to

2044
01:25:18,790 --> 01:25:16,719
give away the part in the story of what

2045
01:25:19,669 --> 01:25:18,800
happens because it's so exciting of this

2046
01:25:21,990 --> 01:25:19,679
you know

2047
01:25:25,189 --> 01:25:22,000
incredible tug of war now between the

2048
01:25:27,110 --> 01:25:25,199
u.s air force and dr alexander and dr

2049
01:25:29,030 --> 01:25:27,120
schreiber because the us air force

2050
01:25:31,550 --> 01:25:29,040
doesn't want to give him up because

2051
01:25:33,270 --> 01:25:31,560
schreiber is one of

2052
01:25:35,669 --> 01:25:33,280
1600

2053
01:25:38,830 --> 01:25:35,679
nazi scientists in america and they they

2054
01:25:42,070 --> 01:25:38,840
have to really play it cautiously

2055
01:25:43,990 --> 01:25:42,080
because you know the whole program could

2056
01:25:46,709 --> 01:25:44,000
be uh unveiled

2057
01:25:49,189 --> 01:25:46,719
now the first picture

2058
01:25:51,030 --> 01:25:49,199
uh that's here is hitler the famous

2059
01:25:52,629 --> 01:25:51,040
picture you know him in front in front

2060
01:25:55,669 --> 01:25:52,639
of the eiffel tower

2061
01:25:59,350 --> 01:25:55,679
uh why did you want to discuss this why

2062
01:26:03,270 --> 01:26:00,229
well

2063
01:26:06,709 --> 01:26:03,280
i think what's interesting there is

2064
01:26:09,750 --> 01:26:06,719
that you see hitler with albert speer

2065
01:26:12,229 --> 01:26:09,760
and albert speer was it spears to the

2066
01:26:14,950 --> 01:26:12,239
left that was hitler's minister of

2067
01:26:16,310 --> 01:26:14,960
armaments and war production

2068
01:26:18,790 --> 01:26:16,320
and to me

2069
01:26:21,590 --> 01:26:18,800
speer was a just a phenomenally

2070
01:26:23,990 --> 01:26:21,600
interesting character because

2071
01:26:27,030 --> 01:26:24,000
the first part of the book i tell you

2072
01:26:29,669 --> 01:26:27,040
about the last six months of the war and

2073
01:26:31,110 --> 01:26:29,679
i show you what some of these scientists

2074
01:26:33,510 --> 01:26:31,120
were actually up to

2075
01:26:36,709 --> 01:26:33,520
and they were all under essentially the

2076
01:26:40,070 --> 01:26:36,719
umbrella of albert speer

2077
01:26:42,950 --> 01:26:40,080
and albert speer was not hung at

2078
01:26:45,910 --> 01:26:42,960
nuremberg he was convicted but he was

2079
01:26:46,950 --> 01:26:45,920
given a 20-year sentence

2080
01:26:56,790 --> 01:26:46,960
and

2081
01:26:58,629 --> 01:26:56,800
himself as the naive nazi you know on

2082
01:27:01,350 --> 01:26:58,639
the reason he wasn't hung

2083
01:27:05,110 --> 01:27:01,360
the reason he was given you know some

2084
01:27:07,110 --> 01:27:05,120
grace so to speak was because he said

2085
01:27:12,870 --> 01:27:07,120
i did not know

2086
01:27:14,790 --> 01:27:12,880
now this is absurd i mean this is

2087
01:27:16,550 --> 01:27:14,800
apocryphal this is fantasy this is

2088
01:27:19,189 --> 01:27:16,560
fiction you're talking about albert

2089
01:27:20,229 --> 01:27:19,199
speer the minister of armaments and war

2090
01:27:22,629 --> 01:27:20,239
production

2091
01:27:24,550 --> 01:27:22,639
you know telling the audience so to

2092
01:27:26,070 --> 01:27:24,560
speak that he did not know about the

2093
01:27:27,990 --> 01:27:26,080
holocaust

2094
01:27:30,550 --> 01:27:28,000
but what happened and i think this is

2095
01:27:33,590 --> 01:27:30,560
such an important

2096
01:27:35,189 --> 01:27:33,600
part of denial and myth-making and

2097
01:27:38,790 --> 01:27:35,199
propaganda is

2098
01:27:41,830 --> 01:27:38,800
by people accepting this nonsense from

2099
01:27:43,830 --> 01:27:41,840
albert speer oh he didn't know

2100
01:27:45,110 --> 01:27:43,840
you know he didn't know

2101
01:27:46,390 --> 01:27:45,120
um

2102
01:27:48,790 --> 01:27:46,400
allowed

2103
01:27:51,110 --> 01:27:48,800
millions of other people

2104
01:27:52,709 --> 01:27:51,120
to claim the same

2105
01:27:54,470 --> 01:27:52,719
ignorance

2106
01:27:56,229 --> 01:27:54,480
i just had a phone call

2107
01:27:58,790 --> 01:27:56,239
just had a a couple of phone calls

2108
01:28:01,270 --> 01:27:58,800
coming in and

2109
01:28:02,229 --> 01:28:01,280
uh let's see here

2110
01:28:03,350 --> 01:28:02,239
okay

2111
01:28:05,430 --> 01:28:03,360
uh

2112
01:28:06,950 --> 01:28:05,440
dave well that's the first call that

2113
01:28:09,189 --> 01:28:06,960
just dropped i just picked it up dave

2114
01:28:11,270 --> 01:28:09,199
just call right back i know you're i

2115
01:28:13,270 --> 01:28:11,280
know you're obviously listening and and

2116
01:28:13,669 --> 01:28:13,280
for everybody

2117
01:28:15,510 --> 01:28:13,679
eight 323

2118
01:28:17,590 --> 01:28:15,520
five fifty forty five

2119
01:28:19,350 --> 01:28:17,600
and he would like to take your phone

2120
01:28:20,709 --> 01:28:19,360
calls and she specifically said before

2121
01:28:22,950 --> 01:28:20,719
the show i wanna take some phone calls

2122
01:28:25,830 --> 01:28:22,960
so the phone lines are open we have a

2123
01:28:29,270 --> 01:28:25,840
little bit of time left with annie so

2124
01:28:31,030 --> 01:28:29,280
uh make the calls quick but we are uh

2125
01:28:33,110 --> 01:28:31,040
officially opening up the phone lines

2126
01:28:34,310 --> 01:28:33,120
the one thing i want to say about spear

2127
01:28:35,430 --> 01:28:34,320
sphere

2128
01:28:39,830 --> 01:28:35,440
is

2129
01:28:42,629 --> 01:28:39,840
for him to claim any innocence at all if

2130
01:28:44,629 --> 01:28:42,639
you know out of hitler's circle

2131
01:28:47,030 --> 01:28:44,639
i mean i wasn't there but out of his

2132
01:28:49,669 --> 01:28:47,040
circle the one guy that i think that

2133
01:28:50,550 --> 01:28:49,679
hitler would would have confided in is

2134
01:28:52,870 --> 01:28:50,560
him

2135
01:28:53,750 --> 01:28:52,880
he was like his friend you know that's

2136
01:28:59,110 --> 01:28:53,760
that

2137
01:29:02,870 --> 01:28:59,120
felt

2138
01:29:05,750 --> 01:29:02,880
hitler

2139
01:29:09,110 --> 01:29:05,760
and i everybody else was competing for

2140
01:29:11,669 --> 01:29:09,120
hitler's you know confidants but out of

2141
01:29:13,830 --> 01:29:11,679
all of them it was albert and albert was

2142
01:29:15,830 --> 01:29:13,840
the one guy if he was if anybody was

2143
01:29:18,070 --> 01:29:15,840
inside of hitler's head it would have

2144
01:29:19,510 --> 01:29:18,080
been him okay got another call coming in

2145
01:29:21,990 --> 01:29:19,520
let's grab this one really quick all

2146
01:29:23,110 --> 01:29:22,000
right you are live with annie who's

2147
01:29:26,070 --> 01:29:23,120
calling

2148
01:29:27,510 --> 01:29:26,080
uh this is dino dino how are you sir say

2149
01:29:29,270 --> 01:29:27,520
hi to annie

2150
01:29:31,669 --> 01:29:29,280
pretty good danny hi

2151
01:29:34,390 --> 01:29:31,679
uh you're first off i want to say i saw

2152
01:29:36,550 --> 01:29:34,400
you on a pbs program i think newshour

2153
01:29:38,229 --> 01:29:36,560
and uh you're very good at uh

2154
01:29:40,870 --> 01:29:38,239
representing you're an intelligent

2155
01:29:43,270 --> 01:29:40,880
intellectual and well-spoken with a good

2156
01:29:45,750 --> 01:29:43,280
voice and we need people like you to

2157
01:29:47,270 --> 01:29:45,760
start getting the truth out about all

2158
01:29:49,270 --> 01:29:47,280
kinds of things so i hope that you'll

2159
01:29:53,510 --> 01:29:49,280
continue your research

2160
01:29:55,030 --> 01:29:53,520
into uh ufos etc

2161
01:29:56,790 --> 01:29:55,040
thank you thank you dino do you have a

2162
01:29:58,629 --> 01:29:56,800
question for annie yeah and so the

2163
01:30:00,870 --> 01:29:58,639
question would be

2164
01:30:01,830 --> 01:30:00,880
do you believe of all these people that

2165
01:30:03,669 --> 01:30:01,840
you've

2166
01:30:06,070 --> 01:30:03,679
met that eventually

2167
01:30:07,350 --> 01:30:06,080
some of them will be willing to go

2168
01:30:12,310 --> 01:30:07,360
public

2169
01:30:14,310 --> 01:30:12,320
are true in other words are they going

2170
01:30:15,750 --> 01:30:14,320
to forget about any threats that were

2171
01:30:17,430 --> 01:30:15,760
made against them by the alphabet

2172
01:30:20,310 --> 01:30:17,440
agencies

2173
01:30:22,149 --> 01:30:20,320
um dino are you referring to paper clip

2174
01:30:25,430 --> 01:30:22,159
or area 51

2175
01:30:27,030 --> 01:30:25,440
or both okay annie

2176
01:30:28,149 --> 01:30:27,040
oh thank you dino thank you very much

2177
01:30:29,510 --> 01:30:28,159
you have been here

2178
01:30:31,030 --> 01:30:29,520
thank you for your question and it's

2179
01:30:34,790 --> 01:30:31,040
really interesting

2180
01:30:38,229 --> 01:30:34,800
my take as a journalist is always to go

2181
01:30:40,310 --> 01:30:38,239
for the specificity in other words

2182
01:30:42,310 --> 01:30:40,320
while like while i think it's really

2183
01:30:44,070 --> 01:30:42,320
important to look at things in like the

2184
01:30:45,350 --> 01:30:44,080
big picture the principle of what is

2185
01:30:47,189 --> 01:30:45,360
going on and it's and i think what

2186
01:30:49,830 --> 01:30:47,199
you're talking about is like secret

2187
01:30:52,070 --> 01:30:49,840
keeping and you know um

2188
01:30:53,910 --> 01:30:52,080
information withholding

2189
01:30:55,110 --> 01:30:53,920
but i

2190
01:30:57,830 --> 01:30:55,120
tend to

2191
01:30:59,030 --> 01:30:57,840
try to be more specific than that broad

2192
01:31:00,310 --> 01:30:59,040
question

2193
01:31:03,510 --> 01:31:00,320
meaning

2194
01:31:05,590 --> 01:31:03,520
i will try and follow a specific story

2195
01:31:08,229 --> 01:31:05,600
like you know why is it that you're not

2196
01:31:09,669 --> 01:31:08,239
telling us about project 57 for example

2197
01:31:11,669 --> 01:31:09,679
and then i will

2198
01:31:13,669 --> 01:31:11,679
really work at reporting that

2199
01:31:16,070 --> 01:31:13,679
information or as i did with these

2200
01:31:18,790 --> 01:31:16,080
individual nazi scientists like wait a

2201
01:31:21,030 --> 01:31:18,800
minute you know so and so let's say dr

2202
01:31:23,350 --> 01:31:21,040
otto ambrose came to the united states

2203
01:31:24,870 --> 01:31:23,360
he was a convicted nazi war criminal he

2204
01:31:27,590 --> 01:31:24,880
worked on hitler's chemical weapons

2205
01:31:29,910 --> 01:31:27,600
programs he was sponsored by dow

2206
01:31:31,189 --> 01:31:29,920
chemical on his visa application i have

2207
01:31:33,990 --> 01:31:31,199
this here in front of me you know this

2208
01:31:35,990 --> 01:31:34,000
kind of specificity please mr official

2209
01:31:36,870 --> 01:31:36,000
with the state department could you tell

2210
01:31:39,270 --> 01:31:36,880
me

2211
01:31:42,070 --> 01:31:39,280
where i can locate the papers to find

2212
01:31:43,750 --> 01:31:42,080
out what this nazi scientist did with

2213
01:31:46,070 --> 01:31:43,760
dow chemical i'm giving you an example

2214
01:31:48,149 --> 01:31:46,080
of specificity and then they say oh we

2215
01:31:49,430 --> 01:31:48,159
actually those papers are lost or

2216
01:31:50,310 --> 01:31:49,440
classified

2217
01:31:53,590 --> 01:31:50,320
so

2218
01:31:55,910 --> 01:31:53,600
i am always seeking the truth but i try

2219
01:31:59,350 --> 01:31:55,920
to keep it real

2220
01:32:00,950 --> 01:31:59,360
um individualized

2221
01:32:05,669 --> 01:32:00,960
and

2222
01:32:09,510 --> 01:32:05,679
going to go into uh the second part of

2223
01:32:11,669 --> 01:32:09,520
this question which was do you think

2224
01:32:12,870 --> 01:32:11,679
is it uncomfortable i mean

2225
01:32:15,110 --> 01:32:12,880
the

2226
01:32:16,790 --> 01:32:15,120
uh everybody that you've interviewed is

2227
01:32:19,189 --> 01:32:16,800
probably starting to get up there in the

2228
01:32:21,750 --> 01:32:19,199
years so is it leaning towards like a

2229
01:32:23,270 --> 01:32:21,760
deathbed confession and would they care

2230
01:32:25,110 --> 01:32:23,280
if that you know

2231
01:32:27,430 --> 01:32:25,120
if uh

2232
01:32:29,910 --> 01:32:27,440
they disclosed who they were and

2233
01:32:31,750 --> 01:32:29,920
actually went public public

2234
01:32:33,270 --> 01:32:31,760
um

2235
01:32:34,709 --> 01:32:33,280
i'll tell you we're really interested

2236
01:32:36,709 --> 01:32:34,719
i've never told anyone this before but i

2237
01:32:39,430 --> 01:32:36,719
will tell you um

2238
01:32:41,110 --> 01:32:39,440
okay since nobody's listening here

2239
01:32:42,709 --> 01:32:41,120
there i mean and every you know

2240
01:32:43,830 --> 01:32:42,719
obviously everyone who's listening but

2241
01:32:46,070 --> 01:32:43,840
um

2242
01:32:49,110 --> 01:32:46,080
there is a very interesting person that

2243
01:32:52,149 --> 01:32:49,120
i report that i for my area 51 named dr

2244
01:32:54,550 --> 01:32:52,159
bud wheelon who was the mayor of area

2245
01:32:55,669 --> 01:32:54,560
51. he was number f there were there are

2246
01:32:58,470 --> 01:32:55,679
four

2247
01:33:00,629 --> 01:32:58,480
head directors at the cia right below

2248
01:33:02,950 --> 01:33:00,639
the the deputy director they have

2249
01:33:04,629 --> 01:33:02,960
different divisions dr weilon was in

2250
01:33:06,830 --> 01:33:04,639
charge of science and technology now he

2251
01:33:10,310 --> 01:33:06,840
was in the basement when kennedy was

2252
01:33:11,189 --> 01:33:10,320
assassinated and dr weyland was a very

2253
01:33:14,310 --> 01:33:11,199
you know

2254
01:33:17,110 --> 01:33:14,320
compassionate brilliant individual i'm

2255
01:33:19,430 --> 01:33:17,120
he spent a lot of time with me talking

2256
01:33:21,189 --> 01:33:19,440
to me very specifically about the

2257
01:33:24,870 --> 01:33:21,199
questions that i had regarding science

2258
01:33:27,270 --> 01:33:24,880
and technology and aircraft at area 51.

2259
01:33:29,030 --> 01:33:27,280
and i always respected the fact that

2260
01:33:31,350 --> 01:33:29,040
um there were certain

2261
01:33:34,390 --> 01:33:31,360
uh discussions that he was not willing

2262
01:33:37,350 --> 01:33:34,400
to have and that that has to be okay

2263
01:33:38,950 --> 01:33:37,360
sometimes if you for example i wanted to

2264
01:33:41,189 --> 01:33:38,960
know about the youtube program and i

2265
01:33:42,629 --> 01:33:41,199
wanted to know about the oxcart program

2266
01:33:43,430 --> 01:33:42,639
and he was willing to talk to me about

2267
01:33:49,270 --> 01:33:43,440
that

2268
01:33:54,070 --> 01:33:49,280
one day

2269
01:33:56,070 --> 01:33:54,080
my phone rang and it was dr weilon

2270
01:33:57,590 --> 01:33:56,080
and this is after the book published and

2271
01:33:59,189 --> 01:33:57,600
he was one of the people who couldn't

2272
01:34:01,189 --> 01:33:59,199
really continue to have a conversation

2273
01:34:02,870 --> 01:34:01,199
with me after the book published

2274
01:34:04,629 --> 01:34:02,880
and

2275
01:34:05,830 --> 01:34:04,639
why is that before we get to the phone

2276
01:34:06,629 --> 01:34:05,840
call

2277
01:34:08,390 --> 01:34:06,639
well

2278
01:34:10,310 --> 01:34:08,400
you know a number of people in the the

2279
01:34:11,669 --> 01:34:10,320
book was very controversial and i think

2280
01:34:13,910 --> 01:34:11,679
you know i i

2281
01:34:16,709 --> 01:34:13,920
see the people who who

2282
01:34:18,310 --> 01:34:16,719
i respect that they were not going to

2283
01:34:19,510 --> 01:34:18,320
they just needed to have that distance

2284
01:34:21,910 --> 01:34:19,520
let's put it that way i mean not

2285
01:34:24,870 --> 01:34:21,920
everybody but certainly dr wheelon is a

2286
01:34:26,790 --> 01:34:24,880
big figure at the cia sure but

2287
01:34:28,390 --> 01:34:26,800
and again i'm this is conjunct you know

2288
01:34:30,310 --> 01:34:28,400
you can you can take this how you want

2289
01:34:32,709 --> 01:34:30,320
but dr wheelon called me and he had not

2290
01:34:33,990 --> 01:34:32,719
caught and i thought that incredible

2291
01:34:35,430 --> 01:34:34,000
when i showed my husband i said look

2292
01:34:36,709 --> 01:34:35,440
because you know the iphone it said dr

2293
01:34:38,950 --> 01:34:36,719
wheel and i

2294
01:34:40,709 --> 01:34:38,960
and i um

2295
01:34:42,790 --> 01:34:40,719
called him he said my husband said call

2296
01:34:44,629 --> 01:34:42,800
him right back i called him right back

2297
01:34:47,350 --> 01:34:44,639
and oh and someone else answered the

2298
01:34:49,830 --> 01:34:47,360
phone and i said oh hi i'm just got a

2299
01:34:52,070 --> 01:34:49,840
call a missed call and they said um oh

2300
01:34:54,070 --> 01:34:52,080
it was the wrong number

2301
01:34:55,510 --> 01:34:54,080
and i said well no you know oh it was

2302
01:34:57,110 --> 01:34:55,520
the wrong number and then

2303
01:35:02,390 --> 01:34:57,120
they hung up

2304
01:35:05,910 --> 01:35:03,750
well

2305
01:35:07,669 --> 01:35:05,920
hmm

2306
01:35:09,270 --> 01:35:07,679
he was probably

2307
01:35:10,390 --> 01:35:09,280
ready

2308
01:35:11,750 --> 01:35:10,400
you know that's the only way that you

2309
01:35:14,470 --> 01:35:11,760
could look out

2310
01:35:16,550 --> 01:35:14,480
or remember not you know to quote

2311
01:35:18,629 --> 01:35:16,560
rumsfeld you don't know what you don't

2312
01:35:21,189 --> 01:35:18,639
know you know he could have done a

2313
01:35:23,110 --> 01:35:21,199
misdial but and again i guess when i say

2314
01:35:25,110 --> 01:35:23,120
that i really mean that's that

2315
01:35:26,870 --> 01:35:25,120
flexibility of the mind i think it's

2316
01:35:29,350 --> 01:35:26,880
important to have right to be able to

2317
01:35:31,430 --> 01:35:29,360
hold these two ideas i certainly do oh

2318
01:35:33,430 --> 01:35:31,440
my goodness what if he was calling me

2319
01:35:36,310 --> 01:35:33,440
with a deathbed confession

2320
01:35:38,470 --> 01:35:36,320
you know yes what if i mean or maybe it

2321
01:35:39,510 --> 01:35:38,480
was a misstyle well

2322
01:35:42,229 --> 01:35:39,520
i'll tell you

2323
01:35:43,669 --> 01:35:42,239
since we're just sitting on on my couch

2324
01:35:46,310 --> 01:35:43,679
talking i'll tell you a little story

2325
01:35:47,110 --> 01:35:46,320
that most of the listeners know but uh i

2326
01:35:49,910 --> 01:35:47,120
will

2327
01:35:50,870 --> 01:35:49,920
it's exactly what we're talking about i

2328
01:35:53,430 --> 01:35:50,880
had

2329
01:35:55,270 --> 01:35:53,440
it hasn't happened for about

2330
01:35:57,830 --> 01:35:55,280
maybe six weeks now

2331
01:35:59,750 --> 01:35:57,840
but i had one of the

2332
01:36:03,430 --> 01:35:59,760
joint chiefs

2333
01:36:06,070 --> 01:36:03,440
calling this show

2334
01:36:07,430 --> 01:36:06,080
and his name would pop up

2335
01:36:09,669 --> 01:36:07,440
and

2336
01:36:11,590 --> 01:36:09,679
mistakenly uh

2337
01:36:13,750 --> 01:36:11,600
i clicked

2338
01:36:17,270 --> 01:36:13,760
on accept

2339
01:36:20,550 --> 01:36:17,280
and we exchanged information obviously

2340
01:36:22,310 --> 01:36:20,560
it says uh with uh skype you know that

2341
01:36:24,550 --> 01:36:22,320
this is a radio station jimmy church

2342
01:36:26,229 --> 01:36:24,560
ufos blah blah blah blah blah you know

2343
01:36:27,350 --> 01:36:26,239
it's all it's all there

2344
01:36:32,550 --> 01:36:27,360
and

2345
01:36:33,990 --> 01:36:32,560
was back um you know i was

2346
01:36:35,350 --> 01:36:34,000
when

2347
01:36:38,629 --> 01:36:35,360
anyway

2348
01:36:40,390 --> 01:36:38,639
i see his information and and uh our

2349
01:36:42,790 --> 01:36:40,400
executive producer and i we were sitting

2350
01:36:44,550 --> 01:36:42,800
here in the studio after the show

2351
01:36:47,590 --> 01:36:44,560
and this popped up

2352
01:36:50,470 --> 01:36:47,600
and anyway i find out that it's a joint

2353
01:36:52,550 --> 01:36:50,480
chiefs guy and i'm just wondering

2354
01:36:54,070 --> 01:36:52,560
is that a misdial

2355
01:36:59,430 --> 01:36:54,080
why why

2356
01:37:00,790 --> 01:36:59,440
just like with dr whelan with you why

2357
01:37:03,109 --> 01:37:00,800
call you

2358
01:37:04,950 --> 01:37:03,119
out of all of the numbers that are in

2359
01:37:07,030 --> 01:37:04,960
his cell phone

2360
01:37:09,910 --> 01:37:07,040
it was you that got misdialed and pocket

2361
01:37:12,470 --> 01:37:09,920
dialed and it's the same thing with this

2362
01:37:14,070 --> 01:37:12,480
there there are no coincidences

2363
01:37:16,149 --> 01:37:14,080
and there's a reason for those phone

2364
01:37:18,229 --> 01:37:16,159
calls now

2365
01:37:22,550 --> 01:37:18,239
i never called him back your husband had

2366
01:37:24,629 --> 01:37:22,560
you call him back i have been encouraged

2367
01:37:28,390 --> 01:37:24,639
the phone calls have come in uh during

2368
01:37:30,709 --> 01:37:28,400
the show and i've been told by listeners

2369
01:37:33,430 --> 01:37:30,719
countless times dude

2370
01:37:35,189 --> 01:37:33,440
pick up the call well as soon as i said

2371
01:37:36,470 --> 01:37:35,199
okay the next time that he calls i'm

2372
01:37:38,070 --> 01:37:36,480
gonna go ahead and do it i'll do it live

2373
01:37:40,550 --> 01:37:38,080
on the air screw it i'm gonna go ahead

2374
01:37:43,270 --> 01:37:40,560
and pick up this phone and i'm gonna ask

2375
01:37:45,510 --> 01:37:43,280
him why are you calling a show that

2376
01:37:49,109 --> 01:37:45,520
deals with conspiracies government

2377
01:37:50,550 --> 01:37:49,119
cover-ups that's the cia the nsa and

2378
01:37:53,350 --> 01:37:50,560
everything else why are you calling this

2379
01:37:55,189 --> 01:37:53,360
show now since i announced that he has

2380
01:37:57,910 --> 01:37:55,199
not called the show back

2381
01:37:59,830 --> 01:37:57,920
and i know you know but it like like you

2382
01:38:01,669 --> 01:37:59,840
said is is it a pocket dial is it a

2383
01:38:03,270 --> 01:38:01,679
mistake well you know what a member of

2384
01:38:04,950 --> 01:38:03,280
the joint chiefs i doubt that he's

2385
01:38:08,470 --> 01:38:04,960
dialing his own phone that's the first

2386
01:38:10,790 --> 01:38:08,480
thing but but if he is he knows exactly

2387
01:38:12,229 --> 01:38:10,800
who he's calling and so was the good

2388
01:38:13,990 --> 01:38:12,239
doctor to you

2389
01:38:16,149 --> 01:38:14,000
you know and there there was a reason

2390
01:38:18,550 --> 01:38:16,159
for it it's too bad you didn't pick up

2391
01:38:20,310 --> 01:38:18,560
the call the first time

2392
01:38:23,270 --> 01:38:20,320
yeah but you know what's what's

2393
01:38:24,470 --> 01:38:23,280
interesting is that and i like to always

2394
01:38:26,870 --> 01:38:24,480
remind

2395
01:38:28,709 --> 01:38:26,880
myself of this is that

2396
01:38:30,950 --> 01:38:28,719
and this is that idea about who knows

2397
01:38:32,709 --> 01:38:30,960
everything you know and this is an idea

2398
01:38:34,310 --> 01:38:32,719
that i love it's an idea chris carter

2399
01:38:37,590 --> 01:38:34,320
loves it's an idea it sounds like you

2400
01:38:40,149 --> 01:38:37,600
love which is that who is is there

2401
01:38:44,149 --> 01:38:40,159
someone who knows everything and what i

2402
01:38:46,149 --> 01:38:44,159
do know is that at a place like area 51

2403
01:38:49,430 --> 01:38:46,159
the majority

2404
01:38:52,310 --> 01:38:49,440
if not everybody but one or two people

2405
01:38:54,629 --> 01:38:52,320
did not know they only knew what they

2406
01:38:57,109 --> 01:38:54,639
needed to know it is literally called

2407
01:38:59,109 --> 01:38:57,119
the need to know and the best way to

2408
01:39:00,950 --> 01:38:59,119
think about that is that everything that

2409
01:39:04,950 --> 01:39:00,960
is happening at area 51 when it's

2410
01:39:07,350 --> 01:39:04,960
happening is classified as a stamp ts

2411
01:39:10,709 --> 01:39:07,360
sci which stands for top secret

2412
01:39:13,350 --> 01:39:10,719
sensitive compartmented information

2413
01:39:16,950 --> 01:39:13,360
now what's fascinating is the protocols

2414
01:39:20,310 --> 01:39:16,960
to classify that ts sci

2415
01:39:23,270 --> 01:39:20,320
those are themselves classified

2416
01:39:27,189 --> 01:39:23,280
so it just automatically says like you

2417
01:39:30,310 --> 01:39:27,199
don't need to know and it allows for

2418
01:39:32,629 --> 01:39:30,320
everybody to only have one piece of the

2419
01:39:36,070 --> 01:39:32,639
information we know this is true i mean

2420
01:39:39,590 --> 01:39:36,080
it's undeniably true and so it makes it

2421
01:39:40,470 --> 01:39:39,600
easier for people to not know the big

2422
01:39:42,550 --> 01:39:40,480
picture

2423
01:39:44,709 --> 01:39:42,560
and it also makes it even more

2424
01:39:46,550 --> 01:39:44,719
intriguing

2425
01:39:48,390 --> 01:39:46,560
to want to know

2426
01:39:49,990 --> 01:39:48,400
who knows the big picture which is why

2427
01:39:52,709 --> 01:39:50,000
that joint jesus staff call is so

2428
01:39:55,030 --> 01:39:52,719
interesting to you why the call to dr

2429
01:39:57,350 --> 01:39:55,040
weilon is to me and why we're all

2430
01:40:00,790 --> 01:39:57,360
searching for the truth because we feel

2431
01:40:02,950 --> 01:40:00,800
like we want to vicariously know we want

2432
01:40:05,910 --> 01:40:02,960
to be that one with all the information

2433
01:40:08,149 --> 01:40:05,920
and then i also sometimes say you know

2434
01:40:09,590 --> 01:40:08,159
does it really exist who really is there

2435
01:40:11,990 --> 01:40:09,600
really one person that has the

2436
01:40:15,189 --> 01:40:12,000
information well that's my question as

2437
01:40:15,950 --> 01:40:15,199
as you were doing your interviews

2438
01:40:17,750 --> 01:40:15,960
uh

2439
01:40:19,750 --> 01:40:17,760
compartmentalization

2440
01:40:21,669 --> 01:40:19,760
is an obvious thing where you know the

2441
01:40:23,750 --> 01:40:21,679
guy working next to you or in the next

2442
01:40:25,189 --> 01:40:23,760
laboratory in the next office upstairs

2443
01:40:26,790 --> 01:40:25,199
downstairs doesn't know what you're

2444
01:40:28,310 --> 01:40:26,800
working on

2445
01:40:29,270 --> 01:40:28,320
somebody

2446
01:40:31,590 --> 01:40:29,280
or

2447
01:40:33,990 --> 01:40:31,600
maybe it's by committee but somebody is

2448
01:40:36,629 --> 01:40:34,000
making those decisions did you start to

2449
01:40:38,390 --> 01:40:36,639
maybe narrow down where these decisions

2450
01:40:40,390 --> 01:40:38,400
were coming from

2451
01:40:43,189 --> 01:40:40,400
is it the white house is it the west

2452
01:40:44,950 --> 01:40:43,199
wing is it the pentagon is it the nsa is

2453
01:40:47,750 --> 01:40:44,960
it cia

2454
01:40:49,430 --> 01:40:47,760
is it one person from each one of the

2455
01:40:52,390 --> 01:40:49,440
three letter

2456
01:40:54,229 --> 01:40:52,400
division i mean yes well it's why what i

2457
01:40:56,550 --> 01:40:54,239
found so interesting and actually

2458
01:40:58,950 --> 01:40:56,560
compelling about my source in the end of

2459
01:41:00,310 --> 01:40:58,960
area 51 is this is that i asked him

2460
01:41:03,109 --> 01:41:00,320
because obviously it involved human

2461
01:41:04,470 --> 01:41:03,119
experiments according to him and clinton

2462
01:41:06,709 --> 01:41:04,480
president clinton

2463
01:41:08,310 --> 01:41:06,719
investigated the crimes of the atomic

2464
01:41:10,950 --> 01:41:08,320
energy commission when it was revealed

2465
01:41:12,550 --> 01:41:10,960
in the 90s that the atomic energy

2466
01:41:16,629 --> 01:41:12,560
commission now called the department of

2467
01:41:18,870 --> 01:41:16,639
energy had been experimenting on humans

2468
01:41:20,950 --> 01:41:18,880
with radiation okay this is a known fact

2469
01:41:23,510 --> 01:41:20,960
and it took one reporter named eileen

2470
01:41:25,430 --> 01:41:23,520
wilson to break the story she won the

2471
01:41:27,270 --> 01:41:25,440
pulitzer prize and it was like oh my god

2472
01:41:27,990 --> 01:41:27,280
what have we done clinton looked into it

2473
01:41:29,590 --> 01:41:28,000
he

2474
01:41:31,430 --> 01:41:29,600
started this enormous committee

2475
01:41:33,270 --> 01:41:31,440
congressional committee to look into it

2476
01:41:35,030 --> 01:41:33,280
and i asked my source when clinton was

2477
01:41:37,750 --> 01:41:35,040
investigating this

2478
01:41:42,790 --> 01:41:37,760
did he find out and the source said he

2479
01:41:46,790 --> 01:41:45,109
with um

2480
01:41:47,990 --> 01:41:46,800
with uh

2481
01:41:54,870 --> 01:41:48,000
the

2482
01:41:56,950 --> 01:41:54,880
humans i'm using that term loosely

2483
01:41:59,590 --> 01:41:56,960
because now i really don't know how to

2484
01:42:01,669 --> 01:41:59,600
categorize that but with the pilots

2485
01:42:05,030 --> 01:42:01,679
let's just say that the pilots that uh

2486
01:42:07,189 --> 01:42:05,040
were recovered in roswell the pilots of

2487
01:42:08,470 --> 01:42:07,199
questionable origin oh yes there you go

2488
01:42:11,189 --> 01:42:08,480
there you go

2489
01:42:13,990 --> 01:42:11,199
were they alive

2490
01:42:16,070 --> 01:42:14,000
according to the source one of them was

2491
01:42:18,149 --> 01:42:16,080
and so

2492
01:42:19,830 --> 01:42:18,159
with the information or dis

2493
01:42:22,790 --> 01:42:19,840
information or the witnesses or

2494
01:42:24,229 --> 01:42:22,800
everything that has been filtered down

2495
01:42:28,390 --> 01:42:24,239
um

2496
01:42:30,790 --> 01:42:28,400
we knew that uh we ne we uh

2497
01:42:32,390 --> 01:42:30,800
i'm so confused my mind is like going in

2498
01:42:33,189 --> 01:42:32,400
five different directions

2499
01:42:35,350 --> 01:42:33,199
is

2500
01:42:38,229 --> 01:42:35,360
um the story

2501
01:42:40,790 --> 01:42:38,239
has been the legend there's the word is

2502
01:42:43,830 --> 01:42:40,800
that uh you know one survived and

2503
01:42:46,950 --> 01:42:43,840
eventually died didn't we know

2504
01:42:49,590 --> 01:42:46,960
that it was not alien

2505
01:42:51,669 --> 01:42:49,600
i mean i understand the the operations

2506
01:42:53,910 --> 01:42:51,679
and so forth but didn't it speak english

2507
01:42:57,030 --> 01:42:53,920
didn't it say where it came from that it

2508
01:42:58,790 --> 01:42:57,040
came from the soviet union or or how did

2509
01:43:00,709 --> 01:42:58,800
do you understand the question

2510
01:43:02,149 --> 01:43:00,719
yes i do understand well according to

2511
01:43:04,070 --> 01:43:02,159
the source the

2512
01:43:06,950 --> 01:43:04,080
first of all according to the source at

2513
01:43:11,109 --> 01:43:06,960
this point there were only five five of

2514
01:43:12,709 --> 01:43:11,119
them that had access to this okay and so

2515
01:43:14,070 --> 01:43:12,719
and that was another part of the need to

2516
01:43:16,070 --> 01:43:14,080
know which is that what i found

2517
01:43:17,669 --> 01:43:16,080
fascinating is that the information was

2518
01:43:20,310 --> 01:43:17,679
with the atomic energy commission the

2519
01:43:22,390 --> 01:43:20,320
atomic energy commission was in charge

2520
01:43:24,229 --> 01:43:22,400
of this program which makes perfect

2521
01:43:25,910 --> 01:43:24,239
sense why you know no one's been able to

2522
01:43:27,750 --> 01:43:25,920
find it because it's not in the cia

2523
01:43:29,990 --> 01:43:27,760
files it's not in the military files

2524
01:43:32,070 --> 01:43:30,000
it's in the aec files they have their

2525
01:43:33,189 --> 01:43:32,080
own system of national security keeping

2526
01:43:34,709 --> 01:43:33,199
that they can just keep something

2527
01:43:37,189 --> 01:43:34,719
classified on the grounds that it

2528
01:43:40,470 --> 01:43:37,199
involves nuclear secrets

2529
01:43:42,390 --> 01:43:40,480
aec has that ability um but as far as

2530
01:43:44,709 --> 01:43:42,400
anybody talking and all of that i mean

2531
01:43:46,950 --> 01:43:44,719
the idea that was always conveyed to me

2532
01:43:49,270 --> 01:43:46,960
is that the damage i don't know if you

2533
01:43:52,709 --> 01:43:49,280
want to call it brain damage or you know

2534
01:43:54,629 --> 01:43:52,719
just that you're you were talking about

2535
01:43:55,830 --> 01:43:54,639
beings that are

2536
01:43:58,310 --> 01:43:55,840
uh

2537
01:44:00,709 --> 01:43:58,320
not exactly coherent let's put it that

2538
01:44:03,030 --> 01:44:00,719
way of course and it's horrific to to

2539
01:44:04,229 --> 01:44:03,040
put your mind there to to think about

2540
01:44:07,109 --> 01:44:04,239
you know what

2541
01:44:09,669 --> 01:44:07,119
just just absolutely horrific so but

2542
01:44:11,910 --> 01:44:09,679
this is this is the crazy part about

2543
01:44:13,510 --> 01:44:11,920
your book area 51

2544
01:44:15,350 --> 01:44:13,520
for everybody out there there is a

2545
01:44:17,910 --> 01:44:15,360
certain amount of relief in the book

2546
01:44:19,669 --> 01:44:17,920
even though it may not

2547
01:44:21,669 --> 01:44:19,679
uh

2548
01:44:24,390 --> 01:44:21,679
your version or your

2549
01:44:26,310 --> 01:44:24,400
uh your informant's version of things

2550
01:44:28,790 --> 01:44:26,320
may not involve

2551
01:44:31,109 --> 01:44:28,800
something from outer space

2552
01:44:32,390 --> 01:44:31,119
but it does confirm that something

2553
01:44:34,950 --> 01:44:32,400
crashed

2554
01:44:38,229 --> 01:44:34,960
in roswell that it wasn't a weather

2555
01:44:39,910 --> 01:44:38,239
balloon and that it was a big cover-up

2556
01:44:42,790 --> 01:44:39,920
from the word go

2557
01:44:44,709 --> 01:44:42,800
and the relief there that everybody is

2558
01:44:46,629 --> 01:44:44,719
not crazy

2559
01:44:48,629 --> 01:44:46,639
and i know you understand exactly where

2560
01:44:51,030 --> 01:44:48,639
i'm going with this that the events

2561
01:44:53,270 --> 01:44:51,040
actually did happen it may not be i

2562
01:44:55,510 --> 01:44:53,280
think it's absolutely i mean

2563
01:44:56,550 --> 01:44:55,520
whenever anybody here's where we agree

2564
01:44:58,070 --> 01:44:56,560
you know the books written by the

2565
01:45:00,470 --> 01:44:58,080
scientists are like it was a weather

2566
01:45:01,430 --> 01:45:00,480
balloon and here's why right i mean

2567
01:45:03,189 --> 01:45:01,440
that's

2568
01:45:04,390 --> 01:45:03,199
i mean that just seems to me silly but

2569
01:45:06,870 --> 01:45:04,400
i'm sure that

2570
01:45:08,550 --> 01:45:06,880
you know to another eye what you're

2571
01:45:10,629 --> 01:45:08,560
talking about is silly and what i'm

2572
01:45:12,229 --> 01:45:10,639
talking about is silly so we're all we

2573
01:45:13,590 --> 01:45:12,239
all have this

2574
01:45:15,350 --> 01:45:13,600
idea

2575
01:45:17,669 --> 01:45:15,360
and i think again that's where it comes

2576
01:45:20,629 --> 01:45:17,679
back to this flexibility of the mind you

2577
01:45:21,830 --> 01:45:20,639
know um and here's you know this

2578
01:45:23,109 --> 01:45:21,840
here's what i'll what i'll throw out

2579
01:45:25,030 --> 01:45:23,119
there too just because i was reading

2580
01:45:25,910 --> 01:45:25,040
about this recently i was reading about

2581
01:45:28,229 --> 01:45:25,920
um

2582
01:45:30,629 --> 01:45:28,239
you know the discovery of the crater in

2583
01:45:32,950 --> 01:45:30,639
the in the 90s that kind of really

2584
01:45:33,750 --> 01:45:32,960
finely sealed the deal scientifically

2585
01:45:37,109 --> 01:45:33,760
that

2586
01:45:39,910 --> 01:45:37,119
a giant comet or asteroid hit the earth

2587
01:45:42,310 --> 01:45:39,920
and wiped out the dinosaurs in kind of a

2588
01:45:44,629 --> 01:45:42,320
succinct extinction okay

2589
01:45:45,669 --> 01:45:44,639
we all know that now okay

2590
01:45:47,430 --> 01:45:45,679
but

2591
01:45:49,430 --> 01:45:47,440
right learning about sort of science

2592
01:45:52,390 --> 01:45:49,440
programs in the 50s

2593
01:45:53,830 --> 01:45:52,400
you know it's that's not that long ago

2594
01:45:55,350 --> 01:45:53,840
and

2595
01:45:56,870 --> 01:45:55,360
all of a sudden having a light bulb go

2596
01:45:59,109 --> 01:45:56,880
off and be like oh my god not only did

2597
01:46:01,830 --> 01:45:59,119
like no one believed that that that the

2598
01:46:03,669 --> 01:46:01,840
dinosaurs went extinct succinctly they

2599
01:46:05,990 --> 01:46:03,679
they thought it happened over you know

2600
01:46:07,990 --> 01:46:06,000
millions and millions of years

2601
01:46:09,910 --> 01:46:08,000
and anyone and when this idea of the

2602
01:46:13,189 --> 01:46:09,920
comet striking earth people these

2603
01:46:15,510 --> 01:46:13,199
scientists the you know walter alvarez

2604
01:46:17,669 --> 01:46:15,520
were laughed out of caltech you know

2605
01:46:20,310 --> 01:46:17,679
they were just they were made fun of for

2606
01:46:21,510 --> 01:46:20,320
having such a silly idea

2607
01:46:22,550 --> 01:46:21,520
and it took

2608
01:46:25,109 --> 01:46:22,560
you know

2609
01:46:26,790 --> 01:46:25,119
14 years of their science and other

2610
01:46:29,030 --> 01:46:26,800
scientists working on the papers and

2611
01:46:30,790 --> 01:46:29,040
examining through geophysics and looking

2612
01:46:33,030 --> 01:46:30,800
at the earth and realizing wait

2613
01:46:35,270 --> 01:46:33,040
this it really looks like it was a very

2614
01:46:37,669 --> 01:46:35,280
quick extinction and then finally

2615
01:46:39,709 --> 01:46:37,679
finding the crater off the yucatan

2616
01:46:41,350 --> 01:46:39,719
peninsula in mexico in

2617
01:46:43,669 --> 01:46:41,360
1992-93

2618
01:46:45,669 --> 01:46:43,679
and now everybody agrees oh yes yes we

2619
01:46:47,830 --> 01:46:45,679
know now you know but

2620
01:46:48,709 --> 01:46:47,840
back up 20 years and who was laughing

2621
01:46:51,669 --> 01:46:48,719
then

2622
01:46:53,350 --> 01:46:51,679
and i also think about that you know

2623
01:46:55,189 --> 01:46:53,360
i'm writing about pentagon science now

2624
01:46:57,109 --> 01:46:55,199
we're going to watch the phone go out um

2625
01:46:59,430 --> 01:46:57,119
you know in the present day so of course

2626
01:47:01,350 --> 01:46:59,440
i look back to the to the 50s

2627
01:47:04,149 --> 01:47:01,360
and then i get reminded wait a minute oh

2628
01:47:08,070 --> 01:47:04,159
my god in 1959 like every single

2629
01:47:12,229 --> 01:47:08,080
scientist in america was busy saying

2630
01:47:14,950 --> 01:47:12,239
absolutely the earth is rigid you know

2631
01:47:17,990 --> 01:47:14,960
it the crust cannot move it's all

2632
01:47:19,910 --> 01:47:18,000
convicted and then i mean convinced you

2633
01:47:22,790 --> 01:47:19,920
know that this and then suddenly the

2634
01:47:24,149 --> 01:47:22,800
idea of plate tectonics surfaces and

2635
01:47:25,669 --> 01:47:24,159
half the people are laughed out of the

2636
01:47:27,510 --> 01:47:25,679
room and the giggle factor and what are

2637
01:47:29,430 --> 01:47:27,520
you guys talking about the earth moves

2638
01:47:31,590 --> 01:47:29,440
and now of course you know we wouldn't

2639
01:47:33,189 --> 01:47:31,600
even think twice you look at you look at

2640
01:47:34,790 --> 01:47:33,199
a map and you just see how the

2641
01:47:37,510 --> 01:47:34,800
continents you know

2642
01:47:38,950 --> 01:47:37,520
they're they're like puzzle pieces but

2643
01:47:41,030 --> 01:47:38,960
yet

2644
01:47:43,910 --> 01:47:41,040
you know 60 years ago

2645
01:47:45,830 --> 01:47:43,920
this was not possible yeah it wasn't not

2646
01:47:48,149 --> 01:47:45,840
only was it not possible it wasn't even

2647
01:47:49,189 --> 01:47:48,159
taught and we haven't started teaching

2648
01:47:50,870 --> 01:47:49,199
what

2649
01:47:53,189 --> 01:47:50,880
i've talked about this on this show so

2650
01:47:55,830 --> 01:47:53,199
many times with uh with uh different

2651
01:47:58,149 --> 01:47:55,840
guests robert shock and john anthony

2652
01:48:00,790 --> 01:47:58,159
west and michael cremo we've uh all

2653
01:48:01,830 --> 01:48:00,800
talked about this very subject

2654
01:48:04,790 --> 01:48:01,840
that

2655
01:48:07,910 --> 01:48:04,800
the continental shift is

2656
01:48:10,870 --> 01:48:07,920
so accepted today that there is no uh

2657
01:48:11,750 --> 01:48:10,880
there there isn't another view that is

2658
01:48:17,350 --> 01:48:11,760
taught

2659
01:48:18,870 --> 01:48:17,360
that

2660
01:48:21,910 --> 01:48:18,880
yesterday

2661
01:48:24,070 --> 01:48:21,920
you know and that's a that's a very

2662
01:48:25,669 --> 01:48:24,080
when uh

2663
01:48:27,669 --> 01:48:25,679
the more that

2664
01:48:29,109 --> 01:48:27,679
uh how to i want to say this correctly

2665
01:48:31,590 --> 01:48:29,119
and i'm glad that we are on the same

2666
01:48:34,149 --> 01:48:31,600
page with this it's just fascinating

2667
01:48:35,990 --> 01:48:34,159
that in 1955

2668
01:48:39,030 --> 01:48:36,000
you were insane

2669
01:48:41,270 --> 01:48:39,040
and yeah and now in 1956 and forward i

2670
01:48:43,270 --> 01:48:41,280
think it's 56 it might be 1957. it

2671
01:48:46,229 --> 01:48:43,280
doesn't matter it was yesterday

2672
01:48:48,629 --> 01:48:46,239
and and and that is the norm today

2673
01:48:51,109 --> 01:48:48,639
you're absolutely right absolutely

2674
01:48:53,189 --> 01:48:51,119
um i wanted to ask you oh

2675
01:48:55,430 --> 01:48:53,199
did did i interrupt

2676
01:48:57,590 --> 01:48:55,440
okay no no no um i was just going to say

2677
01:48:58,390 --> 01:48:57,600
one one more comment that that i came

2678
01:48:59,830 --> 01:48:58,400
across

2679
01:49:01,910 --> 01:48:59,840
on the same subject

2680
01:49:03,910 --> 01:49:01,920
there's a mathematician named john von

2681
01:49:05,510 --> 01:49:03,920
neumann who you know sort of is like the

2682
01:49:06,870 --> 01:49:05,520
father of the computer i mean he's not

2683
01:49:09,350 --> 01:49:06,880
officially the father of a computer but

2684
01:49:10,229 --> 01:49:09,360
let's just call him that and he worked

2685
01:49:11,270 --> 01:49:10,239
with

2686
01:49:13,910 --> 01:49:11,280
um

2687
01:49:16,470 --> 01:49:13,920
an italian scientist who named niels

2688
01:49:18,550 --> 01:49:16,480
baracelle who's sort of like the pre

2689
01:49:20,470 --> 01:49:18,560
pre before anyone thought about

2690
01:49:22,790 --> 01:49:20,480
artificial intelligence about us ellie

2691
01:49:24,149 --> 01:49:22,800
did and von neumann sponsored him to

2692
01:49:26,149 --> 01:49:24,159
come to america and study at the

2693
01:49:28,550 --> 01:49:26,159
princeton princeton institute for

2694
01:49:30,790 --> 01:49:28,560
advanced study and what botochelli was

2695
01:49:33,510 --> 01:49:30,800
interested in was this idea of trying to

2696
01:49:35,189 --> 01:49:33,520
get a computer to help him figure out

2697
01:49:37,510 --> 01:49:35,199
the origin of life

2698
01:49:39,830 --> 01:49:37,520
and on that subject he said and this is

2699
01:49:41,030 --> 01:49:39,840
in 1951

2700
01:49:43,550 --> 01:49:41,040
he said

2701
01:49:45,990 --> 01:49:43,560
if he was talking about like

2702
01:49:48,709 --> 01:49:46,000
microorganisms and this is way before

2703
01:49:51,270 --> 01:49:48,719
biology you know had any kind of the

2704
01:49:54,070 --> 01:49:51,280
field that it does today and barracelli

2705
01:49:57,830 --> 01:49:54,080
said you know there could be

2706
01:50:00,390 --> 01:49:57,840
alien life on earth and scientists would

2707
01:50:02,790 --> 01:50:00,400
not know how to recognize it

2708
01:50:05,030 --> 01:50:02,800
he said this in 1951

2709
01:50:07,030 --> 01:50:05,040
turned a lot of eyeballs but it really

2710
01:50:09,189 --> 01:50:07,040
caught my attention because i thought

2711
01:50:12,390 --> 01:50:09,199
what an interesting forward-thinking

2712
01:50:16,470 --> 01:50:12,400
person to say something like that and be

2713
01:50:18,229 --> 01:50:16,480
willing to risk the giggle factor right

2714
01:50:19,750 --> 01:50:18,239
and today that's exactly how we think

2715
01:50:21,590 --> 01:50:19,760
that's that's even yeah that's

2716
01:50:24,390 --> 01:50:21,600
completely forward thinking

2717
01:50:27,030 --> 01:50:24,400
let me uh really quick before before i

2718
01:50:29,109 --> 01:50:27,040
lose you um

2719
01:50:31,430 --> 01:50:29,119
in all of your research

2720
01:50:34,229 --> 01:50:31,440
and especially with von braun's comments

2721
01:50:37,669 --> 01:50:34,239
that he made much later uh that were

2722
01:50:41,030 --> 01:50:37,679
attributed to him and about off-world

2723
01:50:43,030 --> 01:50:41,040
influence on on on third-reich designs

2724
01:50:45,750 --> 01:50:43,040
not only with you know flying saucers

2725
01:50:49,189 --> 01:50:45,760
but but aircraft in general uh and

2726
01:50:51,669 --> 01:50:49,199
rocketry um

2727
01:50:55,510 --> 01:50:51,679
was there something to what von braun

2728
01:50:57,910 --> 01:50:55,520
and the third reich were on to did

2729
01:51:00,709 --> 01:50:57,920
and i'm not talking about theory or myth

2730
01:51:02,709 --> 01:51:00,719
or mythos i'm specifically talking to

2731
01:51:04,629 --> 01:51:02,719
have you ever uncovered anything where

2732
01:51:08,550 --> 01:51:04,639
you just stepped back and went wow

2733
01:51:13,750 --> 01:51:11,270
no i'm actually not familiar with that

2734
01:51:15,350 --> 01:51:13,760
but what i do know is that

2735
01:51:18,390 --> 01:51:15,360
himmler

2736
01:51:22,470 --> 01:51:18,400
had a lot of re you know

2737
01:51:24,229 --> 01:51:22,480
out there ideas about um

2738
01:51:27,430 --> 01:51:24,239
you know the universe and how the world

2739
01:51:28,550 --> 01:51:27,440
was created and he he he really pursued

2740
01:51:30,790 --> 01:51:28,560
a lot of

2741
01:51:33,830 --> 01:51:30,800
um that so

2742
01:51:35,189 --> 01:51:33,840
maybe there's a crossover in those two

2743
01:51:37,030 --> 01:51:35,199
worlds

2744
01:51:38,950 --> 01:51:37,040
what about the can i ask you about the

2745
01:51:40,070 --> 01:51:38,960
brill did you find anything out about

2746
01:51:43,189 --> 01:51:40,080
the vril

2747
01:51:45,109 --> 01:51:43,199
and did you look into okay

2748
01:51:46,629 --> 01:51:45,119
if you don't know what i'm talking about

2749
01:51:50,470 --> 01:51:46,639
out of the gate then it doesn't matter

2750
01:51:52,790 --> 01:51:50,480
the real was a society of uh

2751
01:51:55,270 --> 01:51:52,800
i was headed up by

2752
01:51:57,510 --> 01:51:55,280
a female it name escapes me right now it

2753
01:52:01,030 --> 01:51:57,520
doesn't matter that supposedly you know

2754
01:52:03,270 --> 01:52:01,040
off-world influence and uh the real

2755
01:52:06,390 --> 01:52:03,280
society and hitler was a part of that

2756
01:52:09,510 --> 01:52:06,400
and and an alien influence there but

2757
01:52:11,270 --> 01:52:09,520
uh you didn't uncover it's v-r-i-l

2758
01:52:14,470 --> 01:52:11,280
you can write that down

2759
01:52:16,390 --> 01:52:14,480
you did not uncover any of that

2760
01:52:19,189 --> 01:52:16,400
okay all right

2761
01:52:22,070 --> 01:52:19,199
okay no you should it's it's hard to the

2762
01:52:23,430 --> 01:52:22,080
thing is uh it's a hard subject to

2763
01:52:26,790 --> 01:52:23,440
uncover

2764
01:52:29,350 --> 01:52:26,800
um the society itself was real but

2765
01:52:31,109 --> 01:52:29,360
because it fell apart as quick as it did

2766
01:52:33,589 --> 01:52:31,119
during world war ii

2767
01:52:36,390 --> 01:52:33,599
there's not much left and it's very hard

2768
01:52:38,390 --> 01:52:36,400
to uncover but yeah go check it out vril

2769
01:52:41,830 --> 01:52:38,400
the real society

2770
01:52:43,270 --> 01:52:41,840
okay now um really quick

2771
01:52:45,750 --> 01:52:43,280
i just want to

2772
01:52:48,070 --> 01:52:45,760
the uh nuremberg photograph that we have

2773
01:52:49,350 --> 01:52:48,080
here it's an interesting cast of

2774
01:52:51,109 --> 01:52:49,360
characters

2775
01:52:52,790 --> 01:52:51,119
uh just take us through this really

2776
01:52:55,030 --> 01:52:52,800
quick only because the audience is

2777
01:52:57,270 --> 01:52:55,040
looking at this picture

2778
01:53:01,350 --> 01:52:57,280
why did you include this

2779
01:53:05,589 --> 01:53:03,830
are we looking at the um the doctors

2780
01:53:09,109 --> 01:53:05,599
sitting is this the doctor's trial with

2781
01:53:12,310 --> 01:53:09,119
kurt blum in the headphones

2782
01:53:14,870 --> 01:53:12,320
yes these are the well i mean you know

2783
01:53:17,030 --> 01:53:14,880
the doctor's trial was the second

2784
01:53:19,910 --> 01:53:17,040
uh of the neuron trials

2785
01:53:22,950 --> 01:53:19,920
and as i show in this picture or as i

2786
01:53:25,510 --> 01:53:22,960
tell rather um

2787
01:53:28,629 --> 01:53:25,520
seven doctors who had been working for

2788
01:53:30,709 --> 01:53:28,639
the u.s army air forces on a secret

2789
01:53:32,390 --> 01:53:30,719
program in heidelberg

2790
01:53:34,709 --> 01:53:32,400
right after war

2791
01:53:36,709 --> 01:53:34,719
part of operation paper clip but could

2792
01:53:37,750 --> 01:53:36,719
not yet be brought to the united states

2793
01:53:39,910 --> 01:53:37,760
because

2794
01:53:42,790 --> 01:53:39,920
it was just way too controversial to

2795
01:53:45,430 --> 01:53:42,800
bring some of these guys over

2796
01:53:47,830 --> 01:53:45,440
knock knock knock seven of them were

2797
01:53:51,030 --> 01:53:47,840
arrested and taken to the nuremberg

2798
01:53:53,589 --> 01:53:51,040
prison to stand trial one of them dr

2799
01:53:55,510 --> 01:53:53,599
theodore benziger was mysteriously

2800
01:53:58,629 --> 01:53:55,520
released into the custody back into the

2801
01:54:00,149 --> 01:53:58,639
custody of the us army air forces put on

2802
01:54:02,070 --> 01:54:00,159
a boat and came to america where he

2803
01:54:05,669 --> 01:54:02,080
lived out a long life and died at the

2804
01:54:08,629 --> 01:54:05,679
age of 94 in bethesda maryland

2805
01:54:10,310 --> 01:54:08,639
the six of them were put on trial

2806
01:54:11,109 --> 01:54:10,320
at the doctor's trial

2807
01:54:15,830 --> 01:54:11,119
um

2808
01:54:18,390 --> 01:54:15,840
specifically in this photo came to the

2809
01:54:19,750 --> 01:54:18,400
united states and and worked here after

2810
01:54:21,109 --> 01:54:19,760
they were acquitted

2811
01:54:23,350 --> 01:54:21,119
and um

2812
01:54:25,510 --> 01:54:23,360
this is part of the story of paperclip

2813
01:54:26,709 --> 01:54:25,520
that's just almost too hard to stomach

2814
01:54:28,950 --> 01:54:26,719
because

2815
01:54:32,229 --> 01:54:28,960
these were doctors who were involved in

2816
01:54:34,550 --> 01:54:32,239
concentration camp experiments exactly

2817
01:54:38,629 --> 01:54:34,560
my question

2818
01:54:42,470 --> 01:54:38,639
is very direct why would we care

2819
01:54:45,270 --> 01:54:42,480
why would we what what use of them what

2820
01:54:46,950 --> 01:54:45,280
what use were they to us i i don't i

2821
01:54:49,270 --> 01:54:46,960
don't get that

2822
01:54:51,669 --> 01:54:49,280
i i don't seriously why why would we

2823
01:54:54,950 --> 01:54:51,679
care what they were expect what kind of

2824
01:54:56,870 --> 01:54:54,960
knowledge could they possibly have

2825
01:54:58,470 --> 01:54:56,880
that we would care about enough to spare

2826
01:55:01,270 --> 01:54:58,480
their lives

2827
01:55:03,910 --> 01:55:01,280
well the american running the program um

2828
01:55:06,709 --> 01:55:03,920
in charge of the of the nazi doctors was

2829
01:55:09,189 --> 01:55:06,719
harry armstrong he's an american hero he

2830
01:55:11,669 --> 01:55:09,199
became the

2831
01:55:13,589 --> 01:55:11,679
second surgeon general of the u.s air

2832
01:55:15,990 --> 01:55:13,599
force there are buildings and schools

2833
01:55:18,790 --> 01:55:16,000
and programs named after him he went to

2834
01:55:21,350 --> 01:55:18,800
berlin specifically in search of these

2835
01:55:23,030 --> 01:55:21,360
doctors because they

2836
01:55:25,990 --> 01:55:23,040
were able to

2837
01:55:28,550 --> 01:55:26,000
work with pilot physiology

2838
01:55:29,910 --> 01:55:28,560
remember this is before planes flew

2839
01:55:33,030 --> 01:55:29,920
really high

2840
01:55:35,270 --> 01:55:33,040
really fast and really far but harry

2841
01:55:36,550 --> 01:55:35,280
armstrong had the vision to know that

2842
01:55:37,750 --> 01:55:36,560
that's where

2843
01:55:39,430 --> 01:55:37,760
aircraft

2844
01:55:43,750 --> 01:55:39,440
was going you know warfighters were

2845
01:55:46,470 --> 01:55:43,760
going and he won everyone knew all the

2846
01:55:49,350 --> 01:55:46,480
u.s army air force physiologists knew

2847
01:55:51,350 --> 01:55:49,360
that the reich had the science behind it

2848
01:55:52,870 --> 01:55:51,360
what we didn't know during the war was

2849
01:55:54,950 --> 01:55:52,880
the reason they had the science behind

2850
01:55:57,030 --> 01:55:54,960
it was because they were able to use

2851
01:55:59,589 --> 01:55:57,040
concentration camp prisoners in their

2852
01:56:01,990 --> 01:55:59,599
experiments they froze people to death

2853
01:56:04,950 --> 01:56:02,000
to see how long you could be frozen

2854
01:56:06,310 --> 01:56:04,960
and die they put people in high altitude

2855
01:56:08,629 --> 01:56:06,320
chambers to see

2856
01:56:10,310 --> 01:56:08,639
how long how much pressure you could

2857
01:56:12,229 --> 01:56:10,320
take before you would explode

2858
01:56:15,189 --> 01:56:12,239
essentially they

2859
01:56:18,390 --> 01:56:15,199
made people drink salt water until they

2860
01:56:20,629 --> 01:56:18,400
died to see how much salt water the

2861
01:56:23,030 --> 01:56:20,639
liver could handle you know these all

2862
01:56:25,350 --> 01:56:23,040
had to do with pilot physiology what

2863
01:56:28,550 --> 01:56:25,360
would happen to a pilot in distress

2864
01:56:30,149 --> 01:56:28,560
we we the u.s army air forces wanted

2865
01:56:33,030 --> 01:56:30,159
that knowledge

2866
01:56:35,510 --> 01:56:33,040
and was willing to

2867
01:56:38,390 --> 01:56:35,520
look the other way about where this

2868
01:56:40,709 --> 01:56:38,400
science had come from and so as

2869
01:56:43,270 --> 01:56:40,719
difficult as it is to believe

2870
01:56:45,030 --> 01:56:43,280
harry armstrong believed that he was

2871
01:56:47,990 --> 01:56:45,040
doing the right thing for his country

2872
01:56:50,310 --> 01:56:48,000
because remember that soviet threat that

2873
01:56:52,790 --> 01:56:50,320
total war with the soviets the war of

2874
01:56:55,750 --> 01:56:52,800
apocalyptic proportion was you know

2875
01:56:57,910 --> 01:56:55,760
bearing down and we needed our pilots to

2876
01:57:00,149 --> 01:56:57,920
be better than theirs and in the eyes of

2877
01:57:03,030 --> 01:57:00,159
the u.s army air forces later the u.s

2878
01:57:04,790 --> 01:57:03,040
air force was we need these german

2879
01:57:07,189 --> 01:57:04,800
scientists

2880
01:57:09,589 --> 01:57:07,199
they know the science let's set them up

2881
01:57:11,990 --> 01:57:09,599
in the united states at the randolph air

2882
01:57:14,470 --> 01:57:12,000
force base

2883
01:57:15,350 --> 01:57:14,480
and that's exactly what they did 34 of

2884
01:57:17,430 --> 01:57:15,360
them

2885
01:57:19,910 --> 01:57:17,440
came to texas and worked as part of the

2886
01:57:23,830 --> 01:57:19,920
program under harry armstrong and the

2887
01:57:26,790 --> 01:57:23,840
lead scientist dr hubertis strughold who

2888
01:57:29,910 --> 01:57:26,800
still has an award named after him given

2889
01:57:32,149 --> 01:57:29,920
out annually in the united states was in

2890
01:57:33,990 --> 01:57:32,159
charge of all of these doctors

2891
01:57:35,990 --> 01:57:34,000
during the war

2892
01:57:38,790 --> 01:57:36,000
for the third reich and he was in charge

2893
01:57:40,790 --> 01:57:38,800
of them here in the united states

2894
01:57:42,629 --> 01:57:40,800
okay quick call just came in let's grab

2895
01:57:44,870 --> 01:57:42,639
this and because we're up against it so

2896
01:57:46,149 --> 01:57:44,880
let's try to get one in before uh before

2897
01:57:49,589 --> 01:57:46,159
you have to leave

2898
01:57:51,510 --> 01:57:49,599
hi you are live with annie

2899
01:57:53,030 --> 01:57:51,520
are you there what's going on yeah i'm

2900
01:57:55,270 --> 01:57:53,040
here

2901
01:57:56,550 --> 01:57:55,280
is this dave hi

2902
01:57:57,990 --> 01:57:56,560
this is dave

2903
01:58:00,550 --> 01:57:58,000
dave do you have a question

2904
01:58:01,910 --> 01:58:00,560
um really quick annie um i know who this

2905
01:58:04,149 --> 01:58:01,920
young man is

2906
01:58:05,510 --> 01:58:04,159
we've been friends for 35 years say hi

2907
01:58:06,629 --> 01:58:05,520
to

2908
01:58:08,310 --> 01:58:06,639
hi dave

2909
01:58:09,910 --> 01:58:08,320
do you have a question

2910
01:58:11,510 --> 01:58:09,920
yeah go ahead

2911
01:58:13,589 --> 01:58:11,520
i was just checking out the show for a

2912
01:58:15,910 --> 01:58:13,599
little bit about 10 minutes ago

2913
01:58:17,830 --> 01:58:15,920
very interesting

2914
01:58:19,510 --> 01:58:17,840
yeah i accidentally was trying to skype

2915
01:58:22,229 --> 01:58:19,520
into you're so excited

2916
01:58:23,910 --> 01:58:22,239
so it's okay um dave do you have a quick

2917
01:58:26,470 --> 01:58:23,920
question before annie has to leave us

2918
01:58:29,109 --> 01:58:26,480
and depart

2919
01:58:30,750 --> 01:58:29,119
i'm not on the top of my head oh you're

2920
01:58:32,550 --> 01:58:30,760
just calling to say hi

2921
01:58:35,669 --> 01:58:32,560
okay

2922
01:58:37,270 --> 01:58:35,679
that's great i love that thank you hello

2923
01:58:38,950 --> 01:58:37,280
all right hey dave

2924
01:58:41,350 --> 01:58:38,960
i'm out in vegas i'm with joe we're

2925
01:58:42,310 --> 01:58:41,360
working on my cd right now so anyways

2926
01:58:43,030 --> 01:58:42,320
okay

2927
01:58:46,709 --> 01:58:43,040
hi

2928
01:58:48,470 --> 01:58:46,719
15 minutes and we'll have a real

2929
01:58:50,870 --> 01:58:48,480
conversation and he's got to get off the

2930
01:58:52,790 --> 01:58:50,880
line here and uh i've got some other

2931
01:58:54,070 --> 01:58:52,800
questions for really quick but uh tell

2932
01:58:56,310 --> 01:58:54,080
joey said hi

2933
01:58:58,950 --> 01:58:56,320
and the world is listening now going

2934
01:59:00,629 --> 01:58:58,960
jimmy has lost control of his show hey

2935
01:59:02,709 --> 01:59:00,639
call me and call

2936
01:59:04,950 --> 01:59:02,719
call me in 15 minutes dave

2937
01:59:06,629 --> 01:59:04,960
on the other line right no no no no

2938
01:59:08,310 --> 01:59:06,639
we're live on the air brother call me in

2939
01:59:09,430 --> 01:59:08,320
15 minutes on the studio line and we'll

2940
01:59:11,189 --> 01:59:09,440
talk

2941
01:59:13,109 --> 01:59:11,199
okay bye

2942
01:59:15,270 --> 01:59:13,119
bye bye

2943
01:59:17,669 --> 01:59:15,280
literally annie friend of mine for 35

2944
01:59:19,830 --> 01:59:17,679
years um okay now i've got a couple of

2945
01:59:22,229 --> 01:59:19,840
other uh emails that came in so i want

2946
01:59:25,270 --> 01:59:22,239
to just run these past you really quick

2947
01:59:28,310 --> 01:59:25,280
uh something doesn't add up uh first the

2948
01:59:30,149 --> 01:59:28,320
opposition wants to send to send fear to

2949
01:59:31,510 --> 01:59:30,159
the american citizens by faking young

2950
01:59:34,070 --> 01:59:31,520
people

2951
01:59:36,310 --> 01:59:34,080
uh to look like aliens and then give

2952
01:59:38,310 --> 01:59:36,320
away the fake technology of an alien

2953
01:59:39,910 --> 01:59:38,320
aircraft sorry but that just doesn't

2954
01:59:43,270 --> 01:59:39,920
work for me

2955
01:59:45,430 --> 01:59:43,280
um i would crash the alien smack bang in

2956
01:59:46,629 --> 01:59:45,440
the middle of a town or city okay all

2957
01:59:48,310 --> 01:59:46,639
right well

2958
01:59:50,790 --> 01:59:48,320
those are obvious questions so i'll let

2959
01:59:53,430 --> 01:59:50,800
y i could almost answer i'll let you go

2960
01:59:57,189 --> 01:59:55,350
you know i that's a great question it's

2961
01:59:59,589 --> 01:59:57,199
a question that has that has come up

2962
02:00:02,070 --> 01:59:59,599
often which is why crash something in

2963
02:00:04,229 --> 02:00:02,080
the middle of nowhere

2964
02:00:07,109 --> 02:00:04,239
yeah well but it wasn't in the middle of

2965
02:00:09,830 --> 02:00:07,119
nowhere it was very close to it was in

2966
02:00:12,550 --> 02:00:09,840
new mexico where we were doing all of

2967
02:00:13,750 --> 02:00:12,560
our missile research number one

2968
02:00:15,750 --> 02:00:13,760
number two

2969
02:00:17,669 --> 02:00:15,760
roswell

2970
02:00:19,430 --> 02:00:17,679
our nuclear wing

2971
02:00:21,669 --> 02:00:19,440
right there

2972
02:00:25,270 --> 02:00:21,679
the army air force base is there so

2973
02:00:29,030 --> 02:00:25,280
there was a lot of reasons to me

2974
02:00:31,589 --> 02:00:29,040
if stalin was going to do that well then

2975
02:00:33,910 --> 02:00:31,599
freak us out you know run a run a flying

2976
02:00:37,750 --> 02:00:33,920
saucer right into our most secretive

2977
02:00:39,109 --> 02:00:37,760
area of the of the world actually

2978
02:00:40,709 --> 02:00:39,119
i mean that is certainly that is

2979
02:00:42,470 --> 02:00:40,719
certainly what what i report in the book

2980
02:00:44,870 --> 02:00:42,480
and i think it's really important to

2981
02:00:48,470 --> 02:00:44,880
also keep in mind that that base at

2982
02:00:51,189 --> 02:00:48,480
roswell was the only base that had

2983
02:00:53,750 --> 02:00:51,199
nuclear bombers and that had you that

2984
02:00:55,750 --> 02:00:53,760
had brought the nuclear bombs

2985
02:00:57,669 --> 02:00:55,760
to bikini island where we were testing

2986
02:01:02,470 --> 02:00:57,679
our bombs kind of really you know

2987
02:01:07,510 --> 02:01:05,910
when we exploded all of these um weapons

2988
02:01:11,189 --> 02:01:07,520
right after the war

2989
02:01:15,430 --> 02:01:13,350
those bombs were

2990
02:01:17,830 --> 02:01:15,440
kept at roswell and then flown on the

2991
02:01:20,310 --> 02:01:17,840
bombers over there so roswell was an

2992
02:01:23,109 --> 02:01:20,320
important place now and the other thing

2993
02:01:25,750 --> 02:01:23,119
the idea of the enemy giving away

2994
02:01:27,350 --> 02:01:25,760
uh alien high tech

2995
02:01:29,589 --> 02:01:27,360
well i don't think

2996
02:01:31,189 --> 02:01:29,599
i don't think stalin planned on having

2997
02:01:32,950 --> 02:01:31,199
that that

2998
02:01:34,149 --> 02:01:32,960
saucer crashed

2999
02:01:36,310 --> 02:01:34,159
right now i mean that wasn't his

3000
02:01:37,910 --> 02:01:36,320
intention it was it was intended to be a

3001
02:01:40,390 --> 02:01:37,920
flyby right

3002
02:01:42,550 --> 02:01:40,400
to freak us out

3003
02:01:45,910 --> 02:01:42,560
that you know it was intended to land

3004
02:01:47,030 --> 02:01:45,920
and i'd how would they know what what

3005
02:01:48,709 --> 02:01:47,040
you know i don't think it was supposed

3006
02:01:50,550 --> 02:01:48,719
to crash i think he was supposed to land

3007
02:01:51,830 --> 02:01:50,560
and come out and leave i don't you know

3008
02:01:55,109 --> 02:01:51,840
i don't know i would be speculating but

3009
02:01:56,950 --> 02:01:55,119
i agree too that is look you know none

3010
02:01:59,350 --> 02:01:56,960
of us are perfect and there are things

3011
02:02:01,910 --> 02:01:59,360
that keep us up at night and those two

3012
02:02:04,149 --> 02:02:01,920
elements also what exactly is that

3013
02:02:05,510 --> 02:02:04,159
technology and where is that now and the

3014
02:02:07,109 --> 02:02:05,520
only thing my source would say about

3015
02:02:10,070 --> 02:02:07,119
that was that's classified which is

3016
02:02:11,510 --> 02:02:10,080
either totally true or a convenient i

3017
02:02:14,149 --> 02:02:11,520
don't want to comment

3018
02:02:16,070 --> 02:02:14,159
or disinformation in general

3019
02:02:17,270 --> 02:02:16,080
again and that was from jc up in

3020
02:02:19,910 --> 02:02:17,280
washington

3021
02:02:22,470 --> 02:02:19,920
and then good question yes and here's

3022
02:02:23,910 --> 02:02:22,480
another one and i almost i was trying to

3023
02:02:26,629 --> 02:02:23,920
get to this earlier

3024
02:02:31,510 --> 02:02:26,639
but uh this comes in from eugene uh he

3025
02:02:33,669 --> 02:02:31,520
says ask her about operation high jump

3026
02:02:36,950 --> 02:02:33,679
ooh operation high jump i don't know we

3027
02:02:39,830 --> 02:02:36,960
have to ask eugene about operation hydra

3028
02:02:41,350 --> 02:02:39,840
there you go eugene stump the panel is

3029
02:02:43,669 --> 02:02:41,360
uh what that was

3030
02:02:46,629 --> 02:02:43,679
all right well hey listen annie thank

3031
02:02:47,750 --> 02:02:46,639
you and what you need to do is well

3032
02:02:50,070 --> 02:02:47,760
you're going to come back after the

3033
02:02:52,550 --> 02:02:50,080
series starts well hopefully that's uh

3034
02:02:54,070 --> 02:02:52,560
sooner than later but you have to come

3035
02:02:55,990 --> 02:02:54,080
back and actually spend some real time

3036
02:02:58,149 --> 02:02:56,000
with us i would like another half hour

3037
02:03:01,109 --> 02:02:58,159
with you tonight you you gave me a drop

3038
02:03:02,470 --> 02:03:01,119
deadline of nine and we're past that

3039
02:03:04,070 --> 02:03:02,480
it's up to you if you want to stick

3040
02:03:06,870 --> 02:03:04,080
around for another 15 minutes that would

3041
02:03:09,430 --> 02:03:06,880
be great if not we could say good night

3042
02:03:10,790 --> 02:03:09,440
it's up to you what would you like to do

3043
02:03:12,149 --> 02:03:10,800
i can stick around for another 15

3044
02:03:14,149 --> 02:03:12,159
minutes all right then let's take a

3045
02:03:16,390 --> 02:03:14,159
quick break let's take two minutes go

3046
02:03:18,390 --> 02:03:16,400
get a quick drink and i'll see you back

3047
02:03:22,790 --> 02:03:18,400
here in two minutes

3048
02:03:26,070 --> 02:03:22,800
sounds great okay thanks all right

3049
02:03:32,229 --> 02:03:28,550
and where's the music the music is not

3050
02:03:35,990 --> 02:03:33,990
keep the emails coming

3051
02:03:44,390 --> 02:03:36,000
don't touch that mouse i'll be back

3052
02:03:51,189 --> 02:03:45,750
hi everybody this is rob halpert the

3053
02:03:55,589 --> 02:03:53,189
what's up my name is brian taylor ninja

3054
02:04:00,550 --> 02:03:55,599
badass extraordinaire and this is

3055
02:04:04,750 --> 02:04:01,390
hey

3056
02:04:06,310 --> 02:04:04,760
jcr in your face

3057
02:04:25,830 --> 02:04:06,320
jimmychurchradio.com

3058
02:04:30,070 --> 02:04:27,430
all right everybody welcome back fade to

3059
02:04:31,669 --> 02:04:30,080
black kjcr dark matter radio network we

3060
02:04:33,669 --> 02:04:31,679
are having a really cool friday got

3061
02:04:35,669 --> 02:04:33,679
annie jacobson with us

3062
02:04:38,149 --> 02:04:35,679
and now's your opportunity the phone

3063
02:04:40,550 --> 02:04:38,159
lines are open i've got annie for

3064
02:04:43,189 --> 02:04:40,560
another 15 minutes

3065
02:04:47,109 --> 02:04:43,199
three two three eight two five fifty

3066
02:04:49,030 --> 02:04:47,119
forty five what i would like to do uh is

3067
02:04:51,430 --> 02:04:49,040
annie are you with us

3068
02:04:54,629 --> 02:04:51,440
yes okay is what i wanted to do you've

3069
02:04:55,910 --> 02:04:54,639
got a cast of characters i went through

3070
02:05:01,350 --> 02:04:55,920
uh

3071
02:05:03,750 --> 02:05:01,360
51 and and i went through i just could

3072
02:05:06,149 --> 02:05:03,760
not believe how many people did you

3073
02:05:07,990 --> 02:05:06,159
interview for the book

3074
02:05:11,189 --> 02:05:08,000
i'm looking at pages

3075
02:05:13,030 --> 02:05:11,199
75 of them were you know tied to area 51

3076
02:05:15,030 --> 02:05:13,040
but there was there were others who you

3077
02:05:17,990 --> 02:05:15,040
know helped me out on background and

3078
02:05:18,790 --> 02:05:18,000
science and whatnot i'm not familiar

3079
02:05:20,870 --> 02:05:18,800
with

3080
02:05:24,310 --> 02:05:20,880
uh some some i am

3081
02:05:27,669 --> 02:05:24,320
okay um you know uh skip slater or slip

3082
02:05:31,189 --> 02:05:27,679
skater slip slater we all know

3083
02:05:33,350 --> 02:05:31,199
uh ray gowdy um but uh can can i just

3084
02:05:36,149 --> 02:05:33,360
kind of like go through

3085
02:05:37,510 --> 02:05:36,159
a list oh here we go first phone call

3086
02:05:38,950 --> 02:05:37,520
coming in hold on let's just grab this

3087
02:05:41,589 --> 02:05:38,960
really quick okay

3088
02:05:43,430 --> 02:05:41,599
you are live with with fade to black and

3089
02:05:45,990 --> 02:05:43,440
annie who's calling

3090
02:05:47,910 --> 02:05:46,000
this is uh village i'm uh

3091
02:05:49,270 --> 02:05:47,920
sorry for the score audio i just wanted

3092
02:05:51,990 --> 02:05:49,280
to correct you really quickly you call

3093
02:05:53,510 --> 02:05:52,000
this a real society braille is the

3094
02:05:56,629 --> 02:05:53,520
energy that they were looking into it

3095
02:05:59,430 --> 02:05:56,639
they're called the fool society oh thule

3096
02:06:00,870 --> 02:05:59,440
you're absolutely right

3097
02:06:02,870 --> 02:06:00,880
brother keep it up

3098
02:06:04,550 --> 02:06:02,880
great

3099
02:06:06,070 --> 02:06:04,560
i really appreciate it

3100
02:06:09,830 --> 02:06:06,080
i love this it's like you've got

3101
02:06:12,390 --> 02:06:09,840
built-in fact checkers yes well you know

3102
02:06:14,229 --> 02:06:12,400
well the thing is which i love about

3103
02:06:16,790 --> 02:06:14,239
this show and it's really

3104
02:06:19,189 --> 02:06:16,800
it's the truth is

3105
02:06:21,669 --> 02:06:19,199
the audience they well they understand

3106
02:06:23,510 --> 02:06:21,679
what i'm about but it's about learning

3107
02:06:25,109 --> 02:06:23,520
and they are very

3108
02:06:27,669 --> 02:06:25,119
very smart

3109
02:06:30,709 --> 02:06:27,679
and i will go through a show i don't

3110
02:06:32,629 --> 02:06:30,719
pretend to know everything i don't i i'm

3111
02:06:35,669 --> 02:06:32,639
i'm all about sharing but at the end of

3112
02:06:36,790 --> 02:06:35,679
the night the emails start flying in

3113
02:06:38,390 --> 02:06:36,800
jimmy

3114
02:06:41,430 --> 02:06:38,400
you know you

3115
02:06:43,669 --> 02:06:41,440
not so much corrections but just you

3116
02:06:44,550 --> 02:06:43,679
know yeah check this out here here's a

3117
02:06:46,229 --> 02:06:44,560
link

3118
02:06:48,550 --> 02:06:46,239
you mentioned this on the show now go

3119
02:06:50,550 --> 02:06:48,560
check this out go check this out and

3120
02:06:52,390 --> 02:06:50,560
it's it's so much fun

3121
02:06:53,990 --> 02:06:52,400
and and there you go so what he was

3122
02:06:56,870 --> 02:06:54,000
referring to

3123
02:07:00,069 --> 02:06:56,880
real was the energy

3124
02:07:02,950 --> 02:07:00,079
and thule and he's right it's t-h i

3125
02:07:06,870 --> 02:07:02,960
believe it's t-h-o-u-l-e

3126
02:07:09,669 --> 02:07:06,880
was the society so but there it is vril

3127
02:07:12,709 --> 02:07:09,679
and thule go check it out it's a cra you

3128
02:07:14,790 --> 02:07:12,719
know it's kind of like you're gonna it's

3129
02:07:16,310 --> 02:07:14,800
it's a rabbit hole

3130
02:07:18,229 --> 02:07:16,320
annie you're gonna open this up and

3131
02:07:20,470 --> 02:07:18,239
you're gonna get sucked in so i'm just

3132
02:07:23,109 --> 02:07:20,480
warning you now

3133
02:07:25,270 --> 02:07:23,119
the real society and the yeah it's uh

3134
02:07:27,270 --> 02:07:25,280
it's it is and and

3135
02:07:31,830 --> 02:07:27,280
the thing is it's real

3136
02:07:34,950 --> 02:07:31,840
there is um there is a movie called

3137
02:07:37,589 --> 02:07:34,960
uh you know what i will email you

3138
02:07:40,709 --> 02:07:37,599
uh there's a there's a movie that's out

3139
02:07:43,669 --> 02:07:40,719
that actually covers this and it came

3140
02:07:46,470 --> 02:07:43,679
out it was a feature film that that just

3141
02:07:49,510 --> 02:07:46,480
didn't hit wide release but um and i

3142
02:07:51,990 --> 02:07:49,520
have the dvd here and before i forget

3143
02:07:54,149 --> 02:07:52,000
or it's a waste valuable time trying to

3144
02:07:55,510 --> 02:07:54,159
remember the title of the movie i will

3145
02:07:58,149 --> 02:07:55,520
get it to you

3146
02:08:00,149 --> 02:07:58,159
and it also covers all of this it's uh i

3147
02:08:02,149 --> 02:08:00,159
think mark wahlberg is or anyway it

3148
02:08:04,229 --> 02:08:02,159
doesn't matter i'll i'll get that to you

3149
02:08:07,030 --> 02:08:04,239
so let's go through this um who was

3150
02:08:12,790 --> 02:08:07,040
colonel leghorn

3151
02:08:16,149 --> 02:08:12,800
amazing to interview he was this famous

3152
02:08:19,830 --> 02:08:16,159
reconnaissance pilot during the war he

3153
02:08:22,550 --> 02:08:19,840
flew over the beaches at normandy then

3154
02:08:25,189 --> 02:08:22,560
before the invasion like in the earliest

3155
02:08:27,030 --> 02:08:25,199
hours of the invasion to take pictures

3156
02:08:28,950 --> 02:08:27,040
and send them back so

3157
02:08:30,550 --> 02:08:28,960
you know he was a famous

3158
02:08:33,350 --> 02:08:30,560
character uh

3159
02:08:34,790 --> 02:08:33,360
the end of the war and then he became

3160
02:08:37,430 --> 02:08:34,800
he was hired

3161
02:08:39,430 --> 02:08:37,440
by um

3162
02:08:41,589 --> 02:08:39,440
to photograph those bombs i was talking

3163
02:08:42,709 --> 02:08:41,599
about the the atomic test at bikini

3164
02:08:45,589 --> 02:08:42,719
atoll

3165
02:08:48,229 --> 02:08:45,599
and he was so amazing he uh is he's

3166
02:08:50,470 --> 02:08:48,239
still alive and he's really old now but

3167
02:08:53,350 --> 02:08:50,480
he was when i was interviewing him he

3168
02:08:55,030 --> 02:08:53,360
went up to his attic and got photographs

3169
02:08:57,430 --> 02:08:55,040
out of the attic and i have one in the

3170
02:09:00,310 --> 02:08:57,440
book that show you can see the tip of

3171
02:09:02,229 --> 02:09:00,320
the wing of his aircraft and the nuclear

3172
02:09:04,310 --> 02:09:02,239
bombs being set off in bikini in the

3173
02:09:06,950 --> 02:09:04,320
background

3174
02:09:07,910 --> 02:09:06,960
but he also really sort of is the father

3175
02:09:11,910 --> 02:09:07,920
of

3176
02:09:13,270 --> 02:09:11,920
aircraft in the sense that he pitched

3177
02:09:17,350 --> 02:09:13,280
this idea

3178
02:09:18,790 --> 02:09:17,360
to the air force um right after the test

3179
02:09:20,550 --> 02:09:18,800
after he saw

3180
02:09:23,030 --> 02:09:20,560
these nuclear weapons go off in the

3181
02:09:25,350 --> 02:09:23,040
pacific and said oh my god we cannot

3182
02:09:27,830 --> 02:09:25,360
have a nuclear war

3183
02:09:30,069 --> 02:09:27,840
and he felt based on his experience and

3184
02:09:32,870 --> 02:09:30,079
reconnaissance that the thing to do is

3185
02:09:35,910 --> 02:09:32,880
to create an aircraft that flew really

3186
02:09:36,910 --> 02:09:35,920
high out of range of the soviet

3187
02:09:38,550 --> 02:09:36,920
missiles

3188
02:09:40,950 --> 02:09:38,560
anti-aircraft

3189
02:09:43,430 --> 02:09:40,960
and uh and take pictures of the soviet

3190
02:09:47,430 --> 02:09:43,440
union and that's exactly what they did

3191
02:09:51,189 --> 02:09:47,440
years later with the u2 which was why

3192
02:09:55,669 --> 02:09:51,199
area 51 the as a u.s air force base and

3193
02:09:57,669 --> 02:09:55,679
as a cia base was built um to

3194
02:10:00,390 --> 02:09:57,679
the the early days

3195
02:10:04,229 --> 02:10:00,400
of the u2 that it that all began there

3196
02:10:06,709 --> 02:10:04,239
you interviewed edward lovick

3197
02:10:08,229 --> 02:10:06,719
oh ed luvik is still with us yeah he

3198
02:10:10,310 --> 02:10:08,239
came to one of my operation paper clip

3199
02:10:11,910 --> 02:10:10,320
book signings the other day so he was a

3200
02:10:14,950 --> 02:10:11,920
it was really pretty amazing and he was

3201
02:10:17,270 --> 02:10:14,960
signing area 51

3202
02:10:19,750 --> 02:10:17,280
copies for anyone who is there the

3203
02:10:23,189 --> 02:10:19,760
grandfather or father of stealth he is

3204
02:10:26,069 --> 02:10:23,199
the man and what was that like i just

3205
02:10:29,990 --> 02:10:27,270
i think

3206
02:10:32,709 --> 02:10:30,000
i did more interviews with ed luvik than

3207
02:10:34,870 --> 02:10:32,719
than anyone and i he he taught me two

3208
02:10:38,149 --> 02:10:34,880
really important things one he told me

3209
02:10:39,270 --> 02:10:38,159
fortune favors the prepared mind i love

3210
02:10:41,510 --> 02:10:39,280
that

3211
02:10:42,470 --> 02:10:41,520
but it's just so interesting and it's

3212
02:10:45,109 --> 02:10:42,480
why

3213
02:10:46,870 --> 02:10:45,119
you know we should just always

3214
02:10:49,589 --> 02:10:46,880
learn um

3215
02:10:52,950 --> 02:10:49,599
fortune favors the prepared mind

3216
02:10:54,229 --> 02:10:52,960
but he also was completely willing

3217
02:10:57,510 --> 02:10:54,239
to

3218
02:10:59,589 --> 02:10:57,520
make science make sense

3219
02:11:01,350 --> 02:10:59,599
for someone who doesn't have a phd in

3220
02:11:03,589 --> 02:11:01,360
science like myself

3221
02:11:05,990 --> 02:11:03,599
and when i was trying to understand what

3222
02:11:07,589 --> 02:11:06,000
stealth technology was

3223
02:11:09,030 --> 02:11:07,599
um you know

3224
02:11:10,229 --> 02:11:09,040
a lot of times when you're interviewing

3225
02:11:11,589 --> 02:11:10,239
and this goes back to your very first

3226
02:11:13,270 --> 02:11:11,599
question you know you're interviewing

3227
02:11:14,310 --> 02:11:13,280
military generals and whatnot you get a

3228
02:11:15,189 --> 02:11:14,320
lot of

3229
02:11:17,430 --> 02:11:15,199
uh

3230
02:11:19,669 --> 02:11:17,440
big words and

3231
02:11:21,030 --> 02:11:19,679
sometimes it's

3232
02:11:22,790 --> 02:11:21,040
just

3233
02:11:24,390 --> 02:11:22,800
somebody being nervous let's say but

3234
02:11:26,310 --> 02:11:24,400
other times it's actually

3235
02:11:27,270 --> 02:11:26,320
covering up a lack of knowledge is what

3236
02:11:30,390 --> 02:11:27,280
i've found

3237
02:11:33,189 --> 02:11:30,400
because the real true

3238
02:11:35,750 --> 02:11:33,199
knowledgeable person like an ed lovick

3239
02:11:38,790 --> 02:11:35,760
will be totally willing to take you back

3240
02:11:41,030 --> 02:11:38,800
to the most basic of

3241
02:11:42,950 --> 02:11:41,040
concepts to help you understand and ed

3242
02:11:44,870 --> 02:11:42,960
luvik did that for me as odd as it

3243
02:11:46,629 --> 02:11:44,880
sounds you know

3244
02:11:49,430 --> 02:11:46,639
trying to explain to me

3245
02:11:51,430 --> 02:11:49,440
how stealth technology worked and he

3246
02:11:53,510 --> 02:11:51,440
used the analogy of a diaper i'm not

3247
02:11:56,470 --> 02:11:53,520
kidding and it actually made sense it

3248
02:11:59,350 --> 02:11:56,480
was like think about how water you know

3249
02:12:01,030 --> 02:11:59,360
gets absorbed into a diaper

3250
02:12:04,709 --> 02:12:01,040
that is how

3251
02:12:07,990 --> 02:12:04,719
radar gets absorbed into

3252
02:12:09,990 --> 02:12:08,000
your coding on the stealth aircraft that

3253
02:12:10,790 --> 02:12:10,000
absorbs the radar instead of bouncing

3254
02:12:12,550 --> 02:12:10,800
back

3255
02:12:15,270 --> 02:12:12,560
and suddenly i understood this concept

3256
02:12:16,069 --> 02:12:15,280
which had remained sort of mysterious to

3257
02:12:17,910 --> 02:12:16,079
me

3258
02:12:23,510 --> 02:12:17,920
for months as i was trying to understand

3259
02:12:28,870 --> 02:12:26,149
al o'donnell was at crossroads that

3260
02:12:31,990 --> 02:12:28,880
bikini tess that we talked about that

3261
02:12:38,310 --> 02:12:34,950
photographed o'donnell was part of a

3262
02:12:39,430 --> 02:12:38,320
team that wired those bombs it was so

3263
02:12:41,189 --> 02:12:39,440
interesting

3264
02:12:42,870 --> 02:12:41,199
learning about that science and that

3265
02:12:46,629 --> 02:12:42,880
engineering and

3266
02:12:49,990 --> 02:12:46,639
you know really seeing how old school

3267
02:12:53,270 --> 02:12:50,000
uh these incredibly high-tech weapons

3268
02:12:54,790 --> 02:12:53,280
were they had elements of this really

3269
02:12:57,669 --> 02:12:54,800
analog

3270
02:13:01,109 --> 02:12:57,679
wiring the the bombs that were

3271
02:13:04,069 --> 02:13:01,119
exploded in bikini were connected

3272
02:13:05,270 --> 02:13:04,079
by underwater cable from the firing

3273
02:13:06,629 --> 02:13:05,280
station

3274
02:13:09,990 --> 02:13:06,639
to the bomb

3275
02:13:11,910 --> 02:13:10,000
and o'donnell told me all about that

3276
02:13:15,669 --> 02:13:11,920
as a first-hand witness that was pretty

3277
02:13:17,589 --> 02:13:15,679
incredible how were you able to i mean

3278
02:13:19,589 --> 02:13:17,599
did each one of these guys they're all

3279
02:13:23,270 --> 02:13:19,599
top secret clearance

3280
02:13:25,109 --> 02:13:23,280
serious serious black ops guys like jim

3281
02:13:26,310 --> 02:13:25,119
friedman i mean

3282
02:13:30,950 --> 02:13:26,320
did

3283
02:13:33,669 --> 02:13:30,960
guy you know you know now you need to go

3284
02:13:35,589 --> 02:13:33,679
talk to because there's no these guys

3285
02:13:37,350 --> 02:13:35,599
don't exist anywhere

3286
02:13:40,310 --> 02:13:37,360
you know they're not in the yellow or

3287
02:13:42,790 --> 02:13:40,320
the white page i mean how on earth did

3288
02:13:45,750 --> 02:13:42,800
you pull all of this off i i don't get

3289
02:13:48,229 --> 02:13:45,760
it so was it just that okay here's

3290
02:13:51,109 --> 02:13:48,239
here's your next guy you know go go call

3291
02:13:51,830 --> 02:13:51,119
this guy yes absolutely i mean you would

3292
02:13:53,589 --> 02:13:51,840
be

3293
02:13:54,950 --> 02:13:53,599
you know for example i was talking to

3294
02:13:57,669 --> 02:13:54,960
jim friedman

3295
02:13:59,270 --> 02:13:57,679
about um photographing you know the

3296
02:14:00,870 --> 02:13:59,280
biggest bomb in the world that we the

3297
02:14:04,709 --> 02:14:00,880
americans ever set off it was called

3298
02:14:06,390 --> 02:14:04,719
castle bravo it was 15 megatons this was

3299
02:14:07,189 --> 02:14:06,400
in 1954

3300
02:14:09,669 --> 02:14:07,199
and

3301
02:14:12,310 --> 02:14:09,679
you know again coming to the story as i

3302
02:14:14,149 --> 02:14:12,320
did not knowing at that point you know

3303
02:14:15,910 --> 02:14:14,159
trying to understand this like wait wait

3304
02:14:17,750 --> 02:14:15,920
we did what and then really

3305
02:14:20,550 --> 02:14:17,760
and i said and i had a million questions

3306
02:14:22,069 --> 02:14:20,560
for for jim friedman and at one point he

3307
02:14:24,149 --> 02:14:22,079
said look you know

3308
02:14:26,069 --> 02:14:24,159
i only know so much because i was

3309
02:14:27,510 --> 02:14:26,079
photographing the bombs the real person

3310
02:14:29,990 --> 02:14:27,520
you want to talk to is al o'donnell

3311
02:14:31,510 --> 02:14:30,000
because he was wiring the bombs and then

3312
02:14:32,870 --> 02:14:31,520
you know what's his number and then

3313
02:14:34,629 --> 02:14:32,880
that's how you go to al o'donnell and

3314
02:14:36,149 --> 02:14:34,639
then you talk to l o'donnell and you say

3315
02:14:38,470 --> 02:14:36,159
but wait a minute what was happening

3316
02:14:40,870 --> 02:14:38,480
with project 57 when we actually set off

3317
02:14:42,870 --> 02:14:40,880
a dirty bomb and he says let me go

3318
02:14:44,870 --> 02:14:42,880
introduce you to my friend richard

3319
02:14:47,750 --> 02:14:44,880
mingus who is the security guard there

3320
02:14:50,629 --> 02:14:47,760
and so you're absolutely right you're

3321
02:14:53,510 --> 02:14:50,639
as a journalist you're looking to

3322
02:14:56,149 --> 02:14:53,520
get information and you get it one

3323
02:14:58,550 --> 02:14:56,159
person at a time and when you're working

3324
02:15:00,550 --> 02:14:58,560
with with great people who i have the

3325
02:15:03,270 --> 02:15:00,560
great fortune i feel of of coming up

3326
02:15:05,030 --> 02:15:03,280
against they're they're willing to say

3327
02:15:08,550 --> 02:15:05,040
well i don't know that but talk to this

3328
02:15:10,629 --> 02:15:08,560
person now mingus and correct me if i'm

3329
02:15:12,149 --> 02:15:10,639
wrong but he was head of security for a

3330
02:15:15,990 --> 02:15:12,159
long time

3331
02:15:17,830 --> 02:15:16,000
and at area 51 he was he was the guy and

3332
02:15:19,350 --> 02:15:17,840
with that type of security clearance

3333
02:15:21,189 --> 02:15:19,360
okay this is

3334
02:15:22,950 --> 02:15:21,199
i just have to ask and i hope you did

3335
02:15:24,069 --> 02:15:22,960
this uh

3336
02:15:25,350 --> 02:15:24,079
for me

3337
02:15:27,510 --> 02:15:25,360
which

3338
02:15:30,149 --> 02:15:27,520
is he is is he forthcoming with

3339
02:15:31,750 --> 02:15:30,159
information and did you actually did you

3340
02:15:32,709 --> 02:15:31,760
cross the line and go okay check this

3341
02:15:34,470 --> 02:15:32,719
out

3342
02:15:36,870 --> 02:15:34,480
richard

3343
02:15:40,149 --> 02:15:36,880
flying saucers or not

3344
02:15:43,189 --> 02:15:40,159
aliens there or not what do you know

3345
02:15:45,990 --> 02:15:43,199
and um and next i have to ask did you

3346
02:15:47,910 --> 02:15:46,000
ever confront anybody about bob lazar

3347
02:15:49,270 --> 02:15:47,920
did his name ever come up

3348
02:15:50,950 --> 02:15:49,280
oh i talked to you know i write about

3349
02:15:51,910 --> 02:15:50,960
bubbles are in the book and i talk to i

3350
02:15:53,510 --> 02:15:51,920
mean i

3351
02:15:55,189 --> 02:15:53,520
i don't you know

3352
02:15:56,709 --> 02:15:55,199
unless when someone says to me look i'll

3353
02:16:00,229 --> 02:15:56,719
talk to you but this is an area you

3354
02:16:02,310 --> 02:16:00,239
can't talk to me about then i then i

3355
02:16:04,390 --> 02:16:02,320
that's fair that's just like all you

3356
02:16:06,550 --> 02:16:04,400
know that's that sounds

3357
02:16:08,790 --> 02:16:06,560
exactly like you're you want to honor

3358
02:16:10,790 --> 02:16:08,800
that contract so to speak of course of

3359
02:16:12,229 --> 02:16:10,800
course very rarely do people do that

3360
02:16:14,950 --> 02:16:12,239
with me bud whelan did that because he

3361
02:16:15,830 --> 02:16:14,960
have obviously had cia obligations

3362
02:16:17,750 --> 02:16:15,840
um

3363
02:16:19,270 --> 02:16:17,760
somebody like richard mingus so in other

3364
02:16:21,350 --> 02:16:19,280
words

3365
02:16:23,350 --> 02:16:21,360
but in general i

3366
02:16:25,030 --> 02:16:23,360
feel that unless someone says and this

3367
02:16:26,790 --> 02:16:25,040
area is off subject then i'm going to

3368
02:16:28,550 --> 02:16:26,800
ask whatever i want of course bob lazar

3369
02:16:30,550 --> 02:16:28,560
came up because you know he's part of

3370
02:16:31,430 --> 02:16:30,560
the area 51 story

3371
02:16:34,389 --> 02:16:31,440
um

3372
02:16:35,830 --> 02:16:34,399
but richard mingus you asked about his

3373
02:16:37,669 --> 02:16:35,840
you know did i ask him certain things i

3374
02:16:39,509 --> 02:16:37,679
mean richard mingus is incredible and

3375
02:16:41,669 --> 02:16:39,519
you can go meet him by the way at the

3376
02:16:43,669 --> 02:16:41,679
atomic testing museum in las vegas he's

3377
02:16:45,349 --> 02:16:43,679
the security guard there and i and

3378
02:16:47,429 --> 02:16:45,359
whenever i'm in vegas i would have lunch

3379
02:16:48,230 --> 02:16:47,439
with richard one of my favorite people

3380
02:16:57,110 --> 02:16:48,240
he

3381
02:16:59,110 --> 02:16:57,120
seek him out at that museum and say will

3382
02:17:02,230 --> 02:16:59,120
you sign my book of course great it's

3383
02:17:03,190 --> 02:17:02,240
just a wonderful thing but richard is

3384
02:17:06,389 --> 02:17:03,200
very

3385
02:17:08,389 --> 02:17:06,399
uh is a man of honor and there were many

3386
02:17:10,469 --> 02:17:08,399
times when he would tell me stories and

3387
02:17:11,509 --> 02:17:10,479
say you know and then i walked up to the

3388
02:17:14,709 --> 02:17:11,519
hangar

3389
02:17:17,830 --> 02:17:14,719
and uh i had to clear it and

3390
02:17:19,190 --> 02:17:17,840
uh i saw what was inside and i closed

3391
02:17:21,030 --> 02:17:19,200
the door and i would say well richard

3392
02:17:23,110 --> 02:17:21,040
tell me what was inside and he said

3393
02:17:24,790 --> 02:17:23,120
i can't tell you

3394
02:17:29,750 --> 02:17:24,800
uh

3395
02:17:32,469 --> 02:17:29,760
have your agreement with him so you

3396
02:17:34,389 --> 02:17:32,479
don't have to say what he said but did

3397
02:17:36,790 --> 02:17:34,399
he tell you anything is there anything

3398
02:17:40,070 --> 02:17:36,800
that you can't share

3399
02:17:42,950 --> 02:17:40,080
no i mean did he confide in you

3400
02:17:44,629 --> 02:17:42,960
i mean you you can go to the atomic

3401
02:17:46,950 --> 02:17:44,639
museum and ask richard the same question

3402
02:17:49,509 --> 02:17:46,960
and he'll tell you he's a real straight

3403
02:17:50,870 --> 02:17:49,519
shooter and he honors his

3404
02:17:53,030 --> 02:17:50,880
um

3405
02:17:53,910 --> 02:17:53,040
you know everybody in the book honors

3406
02:17:55,990 --> 02:17:53,920
their

3407
02:17:58,469 --> 02:17:56,000
commitment to keeping classified

3408
02:18:00,790 --> 02:17:58,479
information classified and

3409
02:18:01,669 --> 02:18:00,800
it's something that you

3410
02:18:04,070 --> 02:18:01,679
work

3411
02:18:05,910 --> 02:18:04,080
with all come up against all the time i

3412
02:18:06,950 --> 02:18:05,920
think as a journalist and that's really

3413
02:18:09,190 --> 02:18:06,960
something

3414
02:18:12,070 --> 02:18:09,200
that is very serious because of the

3415
02:18:14,629 --> 02:18:12,080
espionage act and it's a

3416
02:18:15,830 --> 02:18:14,639
you know it's an it's a it's a real

3417
02:18:21,349 --> 02:18:15,840
um

3418
02:18:25,110 --> 02:18:22,709
i write about him in the book you know i

3419
02:18:26,230 --> 02:18:25,120
mean he's fascinating to me because he i

3420
02:18:28,709 --> 02:18:26,240
spoke to him i mean actually i

3421
02:18:31,589 --> 02:18:28,719
corresponded with him in email yeah i i

3422
02:18:34,150 --> 02:18:31,599
do too um so

3423
02:18:38,070 --> 02:18:34,160
yeah go ahead i i just i'm very curious

3424
02:18:40,389 --> 02:18:38,080
i mean he is part of the area 51 story

3425
02:18:43,349 --> 02:18:40,399
no doubt i mean and he's to me a

3426
02:18:45,589 --> 02:18:43,359
fascinating part because here was a base

3427
02:18:48,389 --> 02:18:45,599
that had been in existence

3428
02:18:49,589 --> 02:18:48,399
since the early 50s that no one knew

3429
02:18:52,549 --> 02:18:49,599
about

3430
02:18:55,830 --> 02:18:52,559
until bob lazar that's i mean just in

3431
02:18:58,629 --> 02:18:55,840
terms of information and need to know

3432
02:18:59,910 --> 02:18:58,639
and propaganda and storytelling all

3433
02:19:02,230 --> 02:18:59,920
these things we've been talking about

3434
02:19:04,870 --> 02:19:02,240
all night you know

3435
02:19:07,990 --> 02:19:04,880
undeniably bob lazar is part of the area

3436
02:19:11,349 --> 02:19:08,000
51 story and always will be because he

3437
02:19:14,150 --> 02:19:11,359
made the situation public

3438
02:19:16,230 --> 02:19:14,160
did anybody confirm with you with all of

3439
02:19:20,389 --> 02:19:16,240
your interviews as bob lazar came up did

3440
02:19:25,589 --> 02:19:24,070
yes i mean yes and and and i think that

3441
02:19:27,270 --> 02:19:25,599
that's um

3442
02:19:28,790 --> 02:19:27,280
you know that's part of the interesting

3443
02:19:30,549 --> 02:19:28,800
story i mean i

3444
02:19:32,230 --> 02:19:30,559
i really

3445
02:19:35,750 --> 02:19:32,240
related to

3446
02:19:38,549 --> 02:19:35,760
i found it fascinating with bob lazar's

3447
02:19:41,270 --> 02:19:38,559
background i mean i think george knapp

3448
02:19:42,070 --> 02:19:41,280
did some incredible reporting in there

3449
02:19:43,270 --> 02:19:42,080
and

3450
02:19:46,830 --> 02:19:43,280
you know

3451
02:19:50,309 --> 02:19:46,840
the way in which he was handled and

3452
02:19:51,349 --> 02:19:50,319
um you know maligned i mean that stuff

3453
02:19:53,830 --> 02:19:51,359
is all

3454
02:19:57,590 --> 02:19:53,840
super interesting to me how

3455
02:19:59,190 --> 02:19:57,600
uh i bel i think you

3456
02:20:01,830 --> 02:19:59,200
whoever that may be that sort of

3457
02:20:06,070 --> 02:20:01,840
mysterious powers that me may that that

3458
02:20:07,670 --> 02:20:06,080
be you know can get a hold of

3459
02:20:09,750 --> 02:20:07,680
of a story

3460
02:20:11,510 --> 02:20:09,760
um and

3461
02:20:14,150 --> 02:20:11,520
really twist it and present it i mean

3462
02:20:15,670 --> 02:20:14,160
that's what i felt because i felt like

3463
02:20:17,429 --> 02:20:15,680
um

3464
02:20:19,429 --> 02:20:17,439
you know

3465
02:20:21,190 --> 02:20:19,439
he had some serious credentials and i

3466
02:20:22,790 --> 02:20:21,200
have no doubt that he met teller and

3467
02:20:26,150 --> 02:20:22,800
that teller was

3468
02:20:28,870 --> 02:20:26,160
his sort of you know referral that's

3469
02:20:31,910 --> 02:20:28,880
based on documentation that i saw

3470
02:20:33,670 --> 02:20:31,920
and so to kind of portray this guy and

3471
02:20:35,030 --> 02:20:33,680
and then also you know he there were

3472
02:20:37,429 --> 02:20:35,040
some things that he said that were not

3473
02:20:39,990 --> 02:20:37,439
truthful and that's really a great

3474
02:20:42,630 --> 02:20:40,000
lesson to all of us of like no matter

3475
02:20:44,469 --> 02:20:42,640
what you know tell the truth i mean

3476
02:20:46,630 --> 02:20:44,479
you could always say no comment but it

3477
02:20:49,190 --> 02:20:46,640
doesn't it doesn't behoove anyone in

3478
02:20:51,030 --> 02:20:49,200
these really incredibly important

3479
02:20:53,670 --> 02:20:51,040
moments to you know

3480
02:20:56,389 --> 02:20:53,680
um embellish and i'm i'm recollecting

3481
02:20:57,590 --> 02:20:56,399
and i hope hope not incorrectly but as i

3482
02:21:01,110 --> 02:20:57,600
recall i think there were some things

3483
02:21:02,550 --> 02:21:01,120
with mit that he had said and

3484
02:21:05,429 --> 02:21:02,560
not exactly line up and that's

3485
02:21:06,469 --> 02:21:05,439
unfortunate right you know well

3486
02:21:07,590 --> 02:21:06,479
the thing

3487
02:21:10,830 --> 02:21:07,600
with bob

3488
02:21:12,710 --> 02:21:10,840
okay well before i make my comments

3489
02:21:14,469 --> 02:21:12,720
um uh

3490
02:21:16,230 --> 02:21:14,479
did you

3491
02:21:19,030 --> 02:21:16,240
have anybody that

3492
02:21:20,950 --> 02:21:19,040
when bob came up that

3493
02:21:21,990 --> 02:21:20,960
that

3494
02:21:24,230 --> 02:21:22,000
uh

3495
02:21:26,469 --> 02:21:24,240
didn't anything negative is what i want

3496
02:21:28,469 --> 02:21:26,479
to say it doesn't you know i i want

3497
02:21:29,750 --> 02:21:28,479
people to read the book and i know that

3498
02:21:30,630 --> 02:21:29,760
you know your comments are in the book

3499
02:21:32,870 --> 02:21:30,640
but

3500
02:21:33,910 --> 02:21:32,880
what i'm getting at is this did anybody

3501
02:21:36,150 --> 02:21:33,920
uh

3502
02:21:38,230 --> 02:21:36,160
deny his story or did anybody say that

3503
02:21:41,429 --> 02:21:38,240
they didn't know him or that bob lazar

3504
02:21:43,990 --> 02:21:41,439
was full of crap oh absolutely

3505
02:21:46,469 --> 02:21:44,000
absolutely i mean i i think you know but

3506
02:21:47,990 --> 02:21:46,479
i tend not that that's just an opinion

3507
02:21:50,950 --> 02:21:48,000
right and you know what they say about

3508
02:21:51,990 --> 02:21:50,960
opinions sure sure sure you know

3509
02:21:54,230 --> 02:21:52,000
so

3510
02:21:56,230 --> 02:21:54,240
i i think you kind of feel that out and

3511
02:21:57,190 --> 02:21:56,240
you get the lay of the land and you you

3512
02:21:59,190 --> 02:21:57,200
know

3513
02:22:01,030 --> 02:21:59,200
you have to be able to differentiate as

3514
02:22:02,870 --> 02:22:01,040
a journalist between what's opinion and

3515
02:22:05,030 --> 02:22:02,880
what's gossip and what's

3516
02:22:07,110 --> 02:22:05,040
what might be important to inform the

3517
02:22:09,510 --> 02:22:07,120
story and i always try to

3518
02:22:11,990 --> 02:22:09,520
refrain from the two

3519
02:22:14,230 --> 02:22:12,000
the two former things you know well with

3520
02:22:15,110 --> 02:22:14,240
the thing is with bob when you go and

3521
02:22:23,670 --> 02:22:15,120
you

3522
02:22:25,590 --> 02:22:23,680
working with an investigative journalist

3523
02:22:28,150 --> 02:22:25,600
that with of high respect and i'm

3524
02:22:29,110 --> 02:22:28,160
talking about mr knapp and i respect a

3525
02:22:31,510 --> 02:22:29,120
lot

3526
02:22:33,750 --> 02:22:31,520
um and you start to

3527
02:22:36,389 --> 02:22:33,760
once you open up that door and you make

3528
02:22:39,190 --> 02:22:36,399
claims of mit or caltech

3529
02:22:40,389 --> 02:22:39,200
or being a physicist or working at los

3530
02:22:42,790 --> 02:22:40,399
alamos and

3531
02:22:45,110 --> 02:22:42,800
edward teller and you're dropping all of

3532
02:22:47,349 --> 02:22:45,120
this stuff you you know

3533
02:22:49,270 --> 02:22:47,359
you're going to get vetted and you know

3534
02:22:51,750 --> 02:22:49,280
they're going to find out and there's

3535
02:22:53,910 --> 02:22:51,760
just no way that you can just run off at

3536
02:22:56,230 --> 02:22:53,920
the mouth like that and create a bunch

3537
02:22:57,990 --> 02:22:56,240
of stuff because if it all comes out to

3538
02:22:59,750 --> 02:22:58,000
be untrue then

3539
02:23:02,710 --> 02:22:59,760
then you're a fraud

3540
02:23:05,910 --> 02:23:02,720
so there must have been a colonel

3541
02:23:08,870 --> 02:23:05,920
a little germ of truth to all of it

3542
02:23:11,030 --> 02:23:08,880
there has to have been something there

3543
02:23:13,510 --> 02:23:11,040
you know and and to put together all of

3544
02:23:17,110 --> 02:23:13,520
the pieces that he did with eg g and the

3545
02:23:18,950 --> 02:23:17,120
flights and area 51 and and

3546
02:23:21,270 --> 02:23:18,960
things like and just like you just said

3547
02:23:23,590 --> 02:23:21,280
that people just didn't know about we

3548
02:23:27,349 --> 02:23:23,600
didn't know about it and and i was

3549
02:23:30,070 --> 02:23:27,359
fascinated and into the subject uh uh in

3550
02:23:31,910 --> 02:23:30,080
the 80s and i remember when bob's story

3551
02:23:34,630 --> 02:23:31,920
first broke and i was like wow i've

3552
02:23:37,429 --> 02:23:34,640
never really there's a secret base

3553
02:23:38,950 --> 02:23:37,439
you know and i thought that i knew a lot

3554
02:23:39,830 --> 02:23:38,960
about the subject

3555
02:23:44,950 --> 02:23:39,840
so

3556
02:23:47,190 --> 02:23:44,960
and then there's the other part

3557
02:23:49,910 --> 02:23:47,200
for bob and that

3558
02:23:53,030 --> 02:23:49,920
maybe just maybe if it is all true

3559
02:23:55,190 --> 02:23:53,040
maybe they did erase a bunch of stuff

3560
02:23:58,070 --> 02:23:55,200
you know i i don't know uh maybe they

3561
02:23:59,910 --> 02:23:58,080
did get rid of his his his education

3562
02:24:01,270 --> 02:23:59,920
history and everything at

3563
02:24:02,710 --> 02:24:01,280
mit

3564
02:24:04,710 --> 02:24:02,720
you know i would like the name of his

3565
02:24:06,950 --> 02:24:04,720
professors i would like the name of a

3566
02:24:09,510 --> 02:24:06,960
couple of schoolmates or something

3567
02:24:11,910 --> 02:24:09,520
that's for somebody to step forward and

3568
02:24:14,389 --> 02:24:11,920
back him up on his story but then again

3569
02:24:16,550 --> 02:24:14,399
it's everything else you got to take by

3570
02:24:19,429 --> 02:24:16,560
you know in its totality

3571
02:24:21,429 --> 02:24:19,439
and for him to talk about element 115

3572
02:24:23,990 --> 02:24:21,439
and then suddenly there is an element

3573
02:24:25,830 --> 02:24:24,000
115 a few years later you got to think

3574
02:24:27,429 --> 02:24:25,840
about a lot of that stuff where it

3575
02:24:31,270 --> 02:24:27,439
didn't it doesn't come from an

3576
02:24:34,870 --> 02:24:33,270
i agree with you and i but again that

3577
02:24:37,030 --> 02:24:34,880
goes back to this idea i think of the

3578
02:24:39,590 --> 02:24:37,040
flexible mind you know and so

3579
02:24:41,590 --> 02:24:39,600
what's interesting is once people have a

3580
02:24:42,790 --> 02:24:41,600
very serious horse in the race and they

3581
02:24:45,590 --> 02:24:42,800
decide

3582
02:24:46,870 --> 02:24:45,600
absolutely it's this way i think that

3583
02:24:49,030 --> 02:24:46,880
the ego

3584
02:24:51,030 --> 02:24:49,040
gets involved and it's hard to back off

3585
02:24:53,429 --> 02:24:51,040
of that and that's why

3586
02:24:56,630 --> 02:24:53,439
i mean i i believe it's better to sort

3587
02:24:58,710 --> 02:24:56,640
of be able to hold ideas you know i mean

3588
02:25:01,190 --> 02:24:58,720
the people that you know decided the

3589
02:25:02,790 --> 02:25:01,200
world was rigid um really held onto

3590
02:25:05,110 --> 02:25:02,800
those ideas for a long time and they

3591
02:25:08,230 --> 02:25:05,120
wrote papers saying you know this idea

3592
02:25:10,389 --> 02:25:08,240
of plate tectonics is hogwash and they

3593
02:25:12,870 --> 02:25:10,399
they really hung onto it they had a

3594
02:25:15,349 --> 02:25:12,880
horse in the race and ultimately it was

3595
02:25:16,309 --> 02:25:15,359
a horse they had to know of um

3596
02:25:17,670 --> 02:25:16,319
but

3597
02:25:19,110 --> 02:25:17,680
time

3598
02:25:21,670 --> 02:25:19,120
reveals

3599
02:25:23,670 --> 02:25:21,680
things and um and i

3600
02:25:25,190 --> 02:25:23,680
i think that if you like if you love

3601
02:25:27,910 --> 02:25:25,200
your subject enough you stick around

3602
02:25:28,790 --> 02:25:27,920
with it for a while more gets revealed

3603
02:25:31,270 --> 02:25:28,800
well

3604
02:25:33,429 --> 02:25:31,280
this is the other thing

3605
02:25:36,309 --> 02:25:33,439
and i'm not in any way making light of

3606
02:25:38,790 --> 02:25:36,319
it anything with bob lazar but if you're

3607
02:25:40,630 --> 02:25:38,800
going to straight face straight face

3608
02:25:41,429 --> 02:25:40,640
into the camera

3609
02:25:44,230 --> 02:25:41,439
for

3610
02:25:46,469 --> 02:25:44,240
30 minutes and go off on a subject like

3611
02:25:48,070 --> 02:25:46,479
he does and doesn't break out in

3612
02:25:51,110 --> 02:25:48,080
laughter

3613
02:25:53,429 --> 02:25:51,120
because it's all you know it's all bs

3614
02:25:55,270 --> 02:25:53,439
and it's just a crazy story

3615
02:25:56,469 --> 02:25:55,280
then he's either the best actor that

3616
02:25:58,710 --> 02:25:56,479
ever was

3617
02:26:01,349 --> 02:25:58,720
or he's telling the truth

3618
02:26:03,670 --> 02:26:01,359
you know there's not a gray area there

3619
02:26:05,990 --> 02:26:03,680
when it comes to blizzard and i

3620
02:26:08,790 --> 02:26:06,000
i spent and i'm sure you did the same

3621
02:26:10,150 --> 02:26:08,800
thing um in your research i spent a lot

3622
02:26:13,190 --> 02:26:10,160
of time

3623
02:26:15,349 --> 02:26:13,200
watching all of his uh video listening

3624
02:26:17,670 --> 02:26:15,359
to all of his interviews

3625
02:26:19,670 --> 02:26:17,680
and i gotta say

3626
02:26:22,150 --> 02:26:19,680
he never he never

3627
02:26:24,790 --> 02:26:22,160
he never fell off the path you know and

3628
02:26:28,950 --> 02:26:24,800
he kept he kept it together

3629
02:26:31,750 --> 02:26:28,960
and i i i i'm in bob's corner and i've

3630
02:26:33,190 --> 02:26:31,760
told him that and and he's you know he's

3631
02:26:35,670 --> 02:26:33,200
he's cool

3632
02:26:37,030 --> 02:26:35,680
um will he be on this show you know i

3633
02:26:38,710 --> 02:26:37,040
don't want to talk about that because i

3634
02:26:40,870 --> 02:26:38,720
don't want any other networks to listen

3635
02:26:44,870 --> 02:26:40,880
to what i'm doing and then turn around

3636
02:26:47,750 --> 02:26:44,880
and and and you know go and do stuff but

3637
02:26:49,190 --> 02:26:47,760
but uh i've invited him on the show and

3638
02:26:50,870 --> 02:26:49,200
i think i think he's going to be here

3639
02:26:52,230 --> 02:26:50,880
very soon

3640
02:26:53,510 --> 02:26:52,240
he doesn't want to talk about the past

3641
02:26:56,469 --> 02:26:53,520
though

3642
02:26:59,910 --> 02:26:56,479
i think the story of area 51

3643
02:27:02,710 --> 02:26:59,920
only will get more interesting

3644
02:27:04,550 --> 02:27:02,720
now okay before i let you go and and

3645
02:27:05,670 --> 02:27:04,560
again you can say if you want but okay

3646
02:27:08,070 --> 02:27:05,680
so

3647
02:27:09,750 --> 02:27:08,080
this is the direct question and answer

3648
02:27:11,830 --> 02:27:09,760
freely please

3649
02:27:12,950 --> 02:27:11,840
is there an alien influence going on out

3650
02:27:15,030 --> 02:27:12,960
there

3651
02:27:18,309 --> 02:27:15,040
off world

3652
02:27:22,550 --> 02:27:18,319
what do you you know a yes or no

3653
02:27:24,790 --> 02:27:22,560
well you know as i write in in my book

3654
02:27:27,750 --> 02:27:24,800
i did not come

3655
02:27:30,389 --> 02:27:27,760
across any of that information

3656
02:27:33,670 --> 02:27:30,399
i came across a lot of underground

3657
02:27:34,950 --> 02:27:33,680
situations that raise a lot of questions

3658
02:27:37,670 --> 02:27:34,960
but um

3659
02:27:38,870 --> 02:27:37,680
but i did not come across an alien

3660
02:27:41,670 --> 02:27:38,880
presence

3661
02:27:42,830 --> 02:27:41,680
has anybody ever whispered to you off

3662
02:27:44,550 --> 02:27:42,840
the record

3663
02:27:50,790 --> 02:27:44,560
that

3664
02:27:52,790 --> 02:27:50,800
they you know any anything off the

3665
02:27:57,030 --> 02:27:52,800
record anything that uh

3666
02:27:59,349 --> 02:27:57,040
i've had a lot of things said to me but

3667
02:28:01,270 --> 02:27:59,359
usually it's along the the lines of

3668
02:28:03,429 --> 02:28:01,280
you're on to something which really

3669
02:28:06,790 --> 02:28:03,439
feels like a bit of a bait i have to say

3670
02:28:09,270 --> 02:28:06,800
but you know that really is the um and

3671
02:28:10,870 --> 02:28:09,280
i've also had people tell me that

3672
02:28:12,870 --> 02:28:10,880
um

3673
02:28:14,790 --> 02:28:12,880
you know

3674
02:28:17,510 --> 02:28:14,800
many people in the government have to

3675
02:28:20,150 --> 02:28:17,520
agree after the book pub was published

3676
02:28:22,469 --> 02:28:20,160
not to comment on it

3677
02:28:23,990 --> 02:28:22,479
you're uh you're you're

3678
02:28:24,830 --> 02:28:24,000
what are you doing tomorrow night you're

3679
02:28:27,990 --> 02:28:24,840
in a

3680
02:28:30,950 --> 02:28:28,000
panel i'm at the los angeles times

3681
02:28:32,550 --> 02:28:30,960
festival of books it's during the day

3682
02:28:34,550 --> 02:28:32,560
and um

3683
02:28:35,910 --> 02:28:34,560
if anyone's in la they should come on

3684
02:28:38,070 --> 02:28:35,920
down because it's just such a it's the

3685
02:28:44,630 --> 02:28:38,080
largest book festival in the country

3686
02:28:47,590 --> 02:28:46,309
the university of southern california

3687
02:28:50,630 --> 02:28:47,600
campus

3688
02:28:52,830 --> 02:28:50,640
downtown and i'm on a panel called the

3689
02:28:55,429 --> 02:28:52,840
truth will get

3690
02:28:57,030 --> 02:28:55,439
out what building what part of the

3691
02:28:58,309 --> 02:28:57,040
campus you know that is a pretty big

3692
02:29:02,230 --> 02:28:58,319
area

3693
02:29:05,750 --> 02:29:02,240
yeah they have maps all over um

3694
02:29:07,590 --> 02:29:05,760
i'm not exactly sure where i am okay uh

3695
02:29:09,190 --> 02:29:07,600
how about on your website is there

3696
02:29:12,870 --> 02:29:09,200
anything there

3697
02:29:15,429 --> 02:29:12,880
yes yes okay jacobson.com and that is

3698
02:29:17,429 --> 02:29:15,439
all linked up uh obviously on

3699
02:29:19,349 --> 02:29:17,439
jimmychurchradio.com

3700
02:29:21,270 --> 02:29:19,359
and i'm just wondering what time are you

3701
02:29:23,750 --> 02:29:21,280
doing it tomorrow

3702
02:29:26,230 --> 02:29:23,760
two o'clock two o'clock i'm wondering if

3703
02:29:28,950 --> 02:29:26,240
uh if i can drag this staff and maybe

3704
02:29:32,550 --> 02:29:28,960
we'll go down there tomorrow and uh and

3705
02:29:34,230 --> 02:29:32,560
and crash the party sounds like oh wow

3706
02:29:35,750 --> 02:29:34,240
you'll be full of questions

3707
02:29:38,309 --> 02:29:35,760
actually sounds like fun who else is on

3708
02:29:39,270 --> 02:29:38,319
the panel with you

3709
02:29:41,990 --> 02:29:39,280
um

3710
02:29:45,670 --> 02:29:42,000
walter kern who has a best seller out

3711
02:29:48,469 --> 02:29:45,680
right now called blood will out

3712
02:29:51,190 --> 02:29:48,479
there is an author named scott johnson

3713
02:29:54,550 --> 02:29:51,200
who wrote a book about himself and his

3714
02:29:56,550 --> 02:29:54,560
cia father

3715
02:29:58,870 --> 02:29:56,560
and that is called the

3716
02:30:01,510 --> 02:29:58,880
the hawk and the watchmen i believe

3717
02:30:02,830 --> 02:30:01,520
and deanne stillman who writes about

3718
02:30:05,190 --> 02:30:02,840
murder in the

3719
02:30:07,910 --> 02:30:05,200
desert and i'm seeing now that we're

3720
02:30:09,910 --> 02:30:07,920
actually at 2 p.m saturday at taper hall

3721
02:30:12,230 --> 02:30:09,920
taper hall okay very good now that's

3722
02:30:14,790 --> 02:30:12,240
easy for everybody all right maybe i'll

3723
02:30:16,469 --> 02:30:14,800
see you tomorrow and i again thank you

3724
02:30:18,550 --> 02:30:16,479
and i can't wait till you're back on the

3725
02:30:21,670 --> 02:30:18,560
show again and hopefully

3726
02:30:23,750 --> 02:30:21,680
it'll be uh before the series starts and

3727
02:30:25,429 --> 02:30:23,760
and again i had a wonderful time and

3728
02:30:27,110 --> 02:30:25,439
thank you for coming out

3729
02:30:28,950 --> 02:30:27,120
thank you so much for having me and for

3730
02:30:31,110 --> 02:30:28,960
all the interesting questions you're the

3731
02:30:32,550 --> 02:30:31,120
best annie i really appreciate it annie

3732
02:30:33,990 --> 02:30:32,560
jacobs and everybody you have a good

3733
02:30:36,230 --> 02:30:34,000
weekend and maybe we'll see you tomorrow

3734
02:30:38,389 --> 02:30:36,240
night

3735
02:30:40,990 --> 02:30:38,399
bye

3736
02:30:42,710 --> 02:30:41,000
fade to black

3737
02:30:45,990 --> 02:30:42,720
jimmychurchradio.com

3738
02:30:47,990 --> 02:30:46,000
on the dark matter radio network i'm

3739
02:30:57,750 --> 02:30:48,000
gonna take a quick break

3740
02:31:00,710 --> 02:30:57,760
emails keep them coming jimmy

3741
02:31:03,510 --> 02:31:00,720
jimmychurchradio.com

3742
02:31:05,190 --> 02:31:03,520
twitter jchurchradio

3743
02:31:12,950 --> 02:31:05,200
and i'll be back right after this friday

3744
02:31:16,550 --> 02:31:14,389
locker center and black listen to

3745
02:31:18,070 --> 02:31:16,560
jimmychurchradio.com

3746
02:31:19,670 --> 02:31:18,080
jeffy church

3747
02:31:23,910 --> 02:31:19,680
church my name is alan i listen to

3748
02:31:28,469 --> 02:31:25,750
he's always giving it to you

3749
02:31:32,469 --> 02:31:28,479
straightradio.com

3750
02:31:34,550 --> 02:31:32,479
on the dark matter radio network

3751
02:31:39,110 --> 02:31:34,560
hi this is rob reiner from anvil and

3752
02:31:43,349 --> 02:31:41,270
what's up i'm chris what up this is kyle

3753
02:31:58,630 --> 02:31:43,359
you're listening to jimmy church radio

3754
02:32:04,790 --> 02:32:01,190
all right

3755
02:32:04,800 --> 02:32:09,270
friday night fade to

3756
02:32:14,230 --> 02:32:10,790
that's what i'm black about dark matter

3757
02:32:19,429 --> 02:32:16,950
keep the emails coming

3758
02:32:22,070 --> 02:32:19,439
got this one that just came in from brad

3759
02:32:24,150 --> 02:32:22,080
says uh hi jimmy great show as always

3760
02:32:26,469 --> 02:32:24,160
you like to hold over a guest so we

3761
02:32:27,910 --> 02:32:26,479
decided to hold you over for a few more

3762
02:32:32,550 --> 02:32:27,920
hours

3763
02:32:36,150 --> 02:32:33,990
so keith that means we're going to bump

3764
02:32:38,309 --> 02:32:36,160
michio kaku

3765
02:32:40,389 --> 02:32:38,319
uh who's after that o'brien alvarez

3766
02:32:41,670 --> 02:32:40,399
brian would absolutely

3767
02:32:43,750 --> 02:32:41,680
shoot me

3768
02:32:46,550 --> 02:32:43,760
shoot you first

3769
02:32:48,469 --> 02:32:46,560
brad i wish we could i it's there's

3770
02:32:50,790 --> 02:32:48,479
nothing better than a dark studio on a

3771
02:32:53,190 --> 02:32:50,800
friday night and i'm telling you what

3772
02:32:55,429 --> 02:32:53,200
uh let's see okay let me see here a

3773
02:32:57,349 --> 02:32:55,439
couple more emails let's see let's see

3774
02:33:00,630 --> 02:32:57,359
let's see

3775
02:33:06,150 --> 02:33:02,790
bikini atoll

3776
02:33:09,030 --> 02:33:06,160
was not a test we actually nuked a uso

3777
02:33:11,510 --> 02:33:09,040
underwater alien craft that came in from

3778
02:33:17,349 --> 02:33:11,520
damon is that right

3779
02:33:22,630 --> 02:33:20,309
damon i'm serious bring me some facts i

3780
02:33:24,230 --> 02:33:22,640
would love to know

3781
02:33:26,469 --> 02:33:24,240
all right keep the emails coming let me

3782
02:33:28,070 --> 02:33:26,479
see here let me do a quick run through

3783
02:33:30,150 --> 02:33:28,080
twitter

3784
02:33:33,590 --> 02:33:30,160
uh

3785
02:33:36,710 --> 02:33:33,600
let's see hi jumped is high jump is the

3786
02:33:38,790 --> 02:33:36,720
antarctica nazi aliens attacking us oh

3787
02:33:42,630 --> 02:33:38,800
that's right

3788
02:33:44,469 --> 02:33:42,640
um actually

3789
02:33:45,349 --> 02:33:44,479
um

3790
02:33:46,830 --> 02:33:45,359
uh

3791
02:33:50,790 --> 02:33:46,840
i'm gonna do a little follow-up on that

3792
02:33:52,150 --> 02:33:50,800
eugene and you and i and somebody else

3793
02:33:54,389 --> 02:33:52,160
we were talking about that a couple of

3794
02:33:56,070 --> 02:33:54,399
weeks ago and we touched upon it

3795
02:33:58,230 --> 02:33:56,080
and i remember

3796
02:33:59,510 --> 02:33:58,240
i wanted to talk about it but the guest

3797
02:34:01,429 --> 02:33:59,520
and i don't want to say the guest name

3798
02:34:03,270 --> 02:34:01,439
the guest didn't want to and you're

3799
02:34:06,630 --> 02:34:03,280
absolutely right

3800
02:34:08,710 --> 02:34:06,640
and i was so angry that night

3801
02:34:10,309 --> 02:34:08,720
uh i had to uh

3802
02:34:12,469 --> 02:34:10,319
i had to hold back

3803
02:34:13,349 --> 02:34:12,479
all right so i want to talk uh really

3804
02:34:17,349 --> 02:34:13,359
quick

3805
02:34:21,030 --> 02:34:17,359
about 370 mh370 i will keep the lines

3806
02:34:23,030 --> 02:34:21,040
open i want your opinions

3807
02:34:24,630 --> 02:34:23,040
three two three eight two five fifty

3808
02:34:27,349 --> 02:34:24,640
forty five

3809
02:34:29,830 --> 02:34:27,359
i'm gonna stir the pot

3810
02:34:31,990 --> 02:34:29,840
right now

3811
02:34:33,270 --> 02:34:32,000
two three eight two five fifty forty

3812
02:34:39,590 --> 02:34:33,280
five

3813
02:34:39,600 --> 02:34:44,469
mh370

3814
02:34:48,630 --> 02:34:45,910
these are facts

3815
02:34:51,190 --> 02:34:48,640
regarding and i'm talking about my mind

3816
02:34:54,630 --> 02:34:51,200
going into a dark place

3817
02:34:55,910 --> 02:34:54,640
and a lot of this uh this was compiled

3818
02:34:58,230 --> 02:34:55,920
and

3819
02:35:02,230 --> 02:34:58,240
the

3820
02:35:03,670 --> 02:35:02,240
you know who you are

3821
02:35:05,429 --> 02:35:03,680
and

3822
02:35:07,349 --> 02:35:05,439
i'm gonna go through it

3823
02:35:10,150 --> 02:35:07,359
and this is where i think things are

3824
02:35:12,710 --> 02:35:10,160
headed and watch

3825
02:35:13,830 --> 02:35:12,720
this is how my life works i'm gonna go

3826
02:35:15,349 --> 02:35:13,840
and i'm gonna go through all of these

3827
02:35:17,590 --> 02:35:15,359
facts and i'm gonna go down this list

3828
02:35:19,750 --> 02:35:17,600
and i am going to get irritated and i'm

3829
02:35:22,469 --> 02:35:19,760
gonna get mad and

3830
02:35:24,230 --> 02:35:22,479
and angry just like you are which is

3831
02:35:27,830 --> 02:35:24,240
fine that's why

3832
02:35:30,230 --> 02:35:27,840
that's why i'm gonna read this stuff

3833
02:35:33,110 --> 02:35:30,240
but then the opposite will turn out to

3834
02:35:38,710 --> 02:35:36,870
okay that's the way it works

3835
02:35:41,590 --> 02:35:38,720
but if i don't read this and if i don't

3836
02:35:43,910 --> 02:35:41,600
get angry and if you don't get angry

3837
02:35:46,710 --> 02:35:43,920
then the opposite of that turns out to

3838
02:35:51,830 --> 02:35:49,510
and that's the way life works

3839
02:35:58,710 --> 02:35:51,840
so you know what i'm gonna read this and

3840
02:36:04,309 --> 02:36:01,910
unreported facts regarding flight mh 370

3841
02:36:10,070 --> 02:36:04,319
in the united states military base

3842
02:36:14,070 --> 02:36:11,910
diego garcia

3843
02:36:17,190 --> 02:36:14,080
is a military island base in the indian

3844
02:36:21,990 --> 02:36:19,830
diego garcia has never been mentioned to

3845
02:36:24,469 --> 02:36:22,000
the public

3846
02:36:26,309 --> 02:36:24,479
and it's not by the way and it's huge by

3847
02:36:29,030 --> 02:36:26,319
the way

3848
02:36:32,389 --> 02:36:29,040
diego garcia has a fully operational

3849
02:36:36,870 --> 02:36:32,399
runway and airport oh yes it does

3850
02:36:40,790 --> 02:36:39,349
you can find it on a map

3851
02:36:43,429 --> 02:36:40,800
you can

3852
02:36:47,030 --> 02:36:43,439
google earth it

3853
02:36:48,550 --> 02:36:47,040
diego garcia is in between

3854
02:36:51,190 --> 02:36:48,560
india

3855
02:36:55,110 --> 02:36:51,200
and australia

3856
02:36:59,830 --> 02:36:57,910
and it's a staging point for our air

3857
02:37:00,870 --> 02:36:59,840
force marines

3858
02:37:06,309 --> 02:37:00,880
navy

3859
02:37:09,230 --> 02:37:08,309
diego garcia

3860
02:37:29,590 --> 02:37:09,240
is

3861
02:37:34,230 --> 02:37:32,550
diego garcia flight coordinates

3862
02:37:36,469 --> 02:37:34,240
were logged

3863
02:37:39,990 --> 02:37:36,479
into

3864
02:37:40,000 --> 02:37:47,110
of the captain of mh370

3865
02:37:52,790 --> 02:37:50,070
the pilot's flight simulator

3866
02:37:57,590 --> 02:37:52,800
has remote takeover

3867
02:38:01,429 --> 02:38:00,150
the data from the pilot's flight

3868
02:38:06,070 --> 02:38:01,439
simulator

3869
02:38:12,469 --> 02:38:08,469
i feel like alex jones

3870
02:38:17,510 --> 02:38:15,830
flight mh370 was under suspicious cargo

3871
02:38:22,950 --> 02:38:17,520
surveillance

3872
02:38:28,630 --> 02:38:25,270
20 of the passengers work for the

3873
02:38:32,870 --> 02:38:28,640
company which specializes in futuristic

3874
02:38:34,230 --> 02:38:32,880
futuristic warfare and technology

3875
02:38:38,070 --> 02:38:34,240
and i know you've

3876
02:38:44,309 --> 02:38:41,590
the australian military radar base

3877
02:38:46,389 --> 02:38:44,319
the generally operational radar network

3878
02:38:48,630 --> 02:38:46,399
has the capabilities of detecting

3879
02:38:51,349 --> 02:38:48,640
movements within a radius

3880
02:38:57,990 --> 02:38:51,359
of 37 000

3881
02:38:58,000 --> 02:39:02,309
that fact alone

3882
02:39:02,319 --> 02:39:06,710
you know and i know

3883
02:39:10,389 --> 02:39:08,150
that the reason why they know where

3884
02:39:14,550 --> 02:39:10,399
those pingers are at right now

3885
02:39:16,870 --> 02:39:14,560
it's because the australian radar knew

3886
02:39:17,910 --> 02:39:16,880
they knew exactly

3887
02:39:19,750 --> 02:39:17,920
now

3888
02:39:21,830 --> 02:39:19,760
whether the plane was shot down or

3889
02:39:24,309 --> 02:39:21,840
whether it crashed or whether it ran out

3890
02:39:25,750 --> 02:39:24,319
of gas the fact is the australians knew

3891
02:39:28,070 --> 02:39:25,760
where it was

3892
02:39:30,950 --> 02:39:28,080
diego garcia is sitting right out there

3893
02:39:33,110 --> 02:39:30,960
and you know

3894
02:39:34,870 --> 02:39:33,120
they know exactly what's going on over

3895
02:39:41,270 --> 02:39:34,880
the indian ocean

3896
02:39:44,950 --> 02:39:42,950
the malaysian authorities have pleaded

3897
02:39:47,030 --> 02:39:44,960
with the us and australia to release to

3898
02:39:55,110 --> 02:39:47,040
them information from their top secret

3899
02:40:01,510 --> 02:39:57,950
island residents of the maldives

3900
02:40:04,230 --> 02:40:01,520
647 miles north of diego garcia reported

3901
02:40:05,590 --> 02:40:04,240
seeing a huge low-flying aircraft

3902
02:40:09,270 --> 02:40:05,600
heading south

3903
02:40:12,230 --> 02:40:09,280
which is the direction of diego garcia

3904
02:40:14,550 --> 02:40:12,240
at 6 15 a.m in the morning

3905
02:40:20,150 --> 02:40:14,560
after it disappeared

3906
02:40:26,309 --> 02:40:23,349
the time of departure from kuala lumpur

3907
02:40:31,349 --> 02:40:26,319
to the time of the plane sighting

3908
02:40:35,590 --> 02:40:33,349
the national maldives defense force

3909
02:40:37,270 --> 02:40:35,600
dismissed these eyewitness accounts on

3910
02:40:42,469 --> 02:40:37,280
the premise

3911
02:40:48,710 --> 02:40:45,349
it is public knowledge that flight mh370

3912
02:40:51,750 --> 02:40:48,720
was not detectable or had lost signal to

3913
02:40:53,990 --> 02:40:51,760
radar almost every member of the public

3914
02:40:56,230 --> 02:40:54,000
had no idea that there was an island in

3915
02:40:59,030 --> 02:40:56,240
the indian ocean housing a u.s military

3916
02:41:04,150 --> 02:40:59,040
base and the airport before

3917
02:41:08,870 --> 02:41:06,469
diego garcia

3918
02:41:10,870 --> 02:41:08,880
has not been mentioned

3919
02:41:12,309 --> 02:41:10,880
in any media

3920
02:41:14,630 --> 02:41:12,319
anywhere

3921
02:41:17,349 --> 02:41:14,640
i haven't read it i haven't seen it have

3922
02:41:19,110 --> 02:41:17,359
you

3923
02:41:20,710 --> 02:41:19,120
we all know about diego garcia the

3924
02:41:22,870 --> 02:41:20,720
people that listen to this show are

3925
02:41:24,630 --> 02:41:22,880
smart

3926
02:41:27,590 --> 02:41:24,640
we've known about diego garcia for a

3927
02:41:30,150 --> 02:41:27,600
long time how can it be removed from any

3928
02:41:33,830 --> 02:41:30,160
conversation anywhere

3929
02:41:37,510 --> 02:41:36,550
i'm going dark and i don't want to go

3930
02:41:39,030 --> 02:41:37,520
dark

3931
02:41:41,349 --> 02:41:39,040
and that's why i'm reading this because

3932
02:41:43,830 --> 02:41:41,359
if i read this and i and i just get this

3933
02:41:45,830 --> 02:41:43,840
out there

3934
02:41:47,830 --> 02:41:45,840
then the opposite will be true and i

3935
02:41:50,630 --> 02:41:47,840
look like a schmuck and then i feel

3936
02:41:55,510 --> 02:41:52,790
but if this doesn't get red then it does

3937
02:41:58,710 --> 02:41:55,520
go dark and my mind goes dark

3938
02:42:05,670 --> 02:41:58,720
and that's the way i cleanse the soul

3939
02:42:12,230 --> 02:42:07,030
i want to take a quick break the phone

3940
02:42:17,670 --> 02:42:14,870
825 50 45 think about what i just read

3941
02:42:19,750 --> 02:42:17,680
to you and i know

3942
02:42:21,030 --> 02:42:19,760
i know you have an opinion

3943
02:42:23,190 --> 02:42:21,040
three two three eight two five fifty

3944
02:42:24,950 --> 02:42:23,200
forty five i'm gonna take a quick break

3945
02:42:26,469 --> 02:42:24,960
this is faded black on a friday night on

3946
02:42:28,070 --> 02:42:26,479
the dark matter radio network i'm your

3947
02:42:30,230 --> 02:42:28,080
host jimmy church

3948
02:42:41,030 --> 02:42:30,240
don't touch that mouse

3949
02:42:47,910 --> 02:42:43,590
despite popular opinion

3950
02:42:53,590 --> 02:42:50,389
but listening to jimmy church will

3951
02:42:55,990 --> 02:42:53,600
on the dark matter radio network

3952
02:43:14,950 --> 02:42:56,000
he's always giving it to you straight

3953
02:43:14,960 --> 02:43:36,950
this is kjcr jimmychurchradio.com

3954
02:43:36,960 --> 02:43:51,030
all right everybody welcome back

3955
02:43:54,630 --> 02:43:53,349
i got this email

3956
02:43:56,230 --> 02:43:54,640
i'm not going to say the person's name

3957
02:43:57,990 --> 02:43:56,240
but i got this email

3958
02:44:03,110 --> 02:43:58,000
uh

3959
02:44:04,550 --> 02:44:03,120
and i i came across your radio show blah

3960
02:44:06,550 --> 02:44:04,560
blah blah

3961
02:44:07,750 --> 02:44:06,560
i've heard

3962
02:44:23,750 --> 02:44:07,760
i

3963
02:44:25,269 --> 02:44:23,760
asked are 90 percent

3964
02:44:30,389 --> 02:44:25,279
on

3965
02:44:32,150 --> 02:44:30,399
asked anybody in my living room perhaps

3966
02:44:34,070 --> 02:44:32,160
that is because ironically many of the

3967
02:44:37,269 --> 02:44:34,080
things you have mentioned make me think

3968
02:44:39,750 --> 02:44:37,279
you are much the same as myself even

3969
02:44:41,910 --> 02:44:39,760
down to loving clive kessler

3970
02:44:44,710 --> 02:44:41,920
okay i've got a call coming in i'm going

3971
02:44:48,309 --> 02:44:44,720
to finish this email uh after this

3972
02:44:52,070 --> 02:44:49,990
hello hi

3973
02:44:53,429 --> 02:44:52,080
hi this is dino

3974
02:44:55,190 --> 02:44:53,439
oh hi dino

3975
02:44:58,550 --> 02:44:55,200
how are you sir

3976
02:45:01,349 --> 02:44:58,560
i had a follow-up question okay uh just

3977
02:45:03,830 --> 02:45:01,359
what you mentioned in your reading uh

3978
02:45:06,150 --> 02:45:03,840
you know when we had no unknown facts

3979
02:45:08,950 --> 02:45:06,160
and new information comes as long as it

3980
02:45:11,750 --> 02:45:08,960
is the truth and not misinformation then

3981
02:45:13,349 --> 02:45:11,760
we can make better opinions and related

3982
02:45:14,950 --> 02:45:13,359
to what you just said was when you had

3983
02:45:16,790 --> 02:45:14,960
whitley strieber on i couldn't get

3984
02:45:19,670 --> 02:45:16,800
through a few weeks ago

3985
02:45:21,429 --> 02:45:19,680
and i had met with me once

3986
02:45:23,269 --> 02:45:21,439
at one of these conferences several

3987
02:45:24,950 --> 02:45:23,279
years ago in the 90s

3988
02:45:26,950 --> 02:45:24,960
and it's a similar thing to what you

3989
02:45:29,110 --> 02:45:26,960
mentioned i asked him i said you know i

3990
02:45:30,870 --> 02:45:29,120
was alone with him in a speaker's room

3991
02:45:34,150 --> 02:45:30,880
and i said you know the very reason i

3992
02:45:35,990 --> 02:45:34,160
got into ufo and conspiracy theories was

3993
02:45:37,590 --> 02:45:36,000
because i saw you on johnny carson's

3994
02:45:39,429 --> 02:45:37,600
tonight show

3995
02:45:41,349 --> 02:45:39,439
and i said when he announced you he

3996
02:45:43,910 --> 02:45:41,359
usually would make ridicule or make fun

3997
02:45:45,670 --> 02:45:43,920
of people he thought were ridiculous

3998
02:45:47,990 --> 02:45:45,680
i said but when you came out he took you

3999
02:45:50,070 --> 02:45:48,000
very seriously and he let you speak even

4000
02:45:52,070 --> 02:45:50,080
though you seem quite frightened

4001
02:45:53,750 --> 02:45:52,080
and whitley took me aside at that point

4002
02:45:56,550 --> 02:45:53,760
he goes well let me tell you why johnny

4003
02:45:58,389 --> 02:45:56,560
was so respectful to me back in the 90s

4004
02:46:00,630 --> 02:45:58,399
and i can say this now because johnny's

4005
02:46:03,429 --> 02:46:00,640
dead he said

4006
02:46:05,990 --> 02:46:03,439
johnny and his wife joan

4007
02:46:08,150 --> 02:46:06,000
at their house in malibu had seen ufos

4008
02:46:10,150 --> 02:46:08,160
off the coast and he goes that's why he

4009
02:46:12,790 --> 02:46:10,160
had me on the show so the new

4010
02:46:14,309 --> 02:46:12,800
information that's the truth

4011
02:46:16,469 --> 02:46:14,319
gets you mind to go in different

4012
02:46:17,910 --> 02:46:16,479
directions to find the truth

4013
02:46:20,710 --> 02:46:17,920
well you know and that's

4014
02:46:23,110 --> 02:46:20,720
one of the things uh dino when i have

4015
02:46:25,030 --> 02:46:23,120
people on the show and this you you hit

4016
02:46:26,389 --> 02:46:25,040
the nail on the head

4017
02:46:28,150 --> 02:46:26,399
is

4018
02:46:32,790 --> 02:46:28,160
i want to

4019
02:46:34,790 --> 02:46:32,800
guests that are on this show are

4020
02:46:35,670 --> 02:46:34,800
comfortable with that

4021
02:46:39,510 --> 02:46:35,680
and

4022
02:46:41,750 --> 02:46:39,520
you know what i mean because you have to

4023
02:46:43,990 --> 02:46:41,760
ask the right questions

4024
02:46:45,670 --> 02:46:44,000
but it's not necessarily the questions

4025
02:46:48,230 --> 02:46:45,680
it's about

4026
02:46:51,110 --> 02:46:48,240
being comfortable and that's exactly and

4027
02:46:52,870 --> 02:46:51,120
and you're exactly right and and and

4028
02:46:55,269 --> 02:46:52,880
carson was comfortable

4029
02:46:57,750 --> 02:46:55,279
and the guests that come on this show

4030
02:46:59,429 --> 02:46:57,760
every single time i i warn them ahead of

4031
02:47:00,710 --> 02:46:59,439
time this isn't going to be what you

4032
02:47:02,790 --> 02:47:00,720
think

4033
02:47:03,910 --> 02:47:02,800
you know it's it's not you're going to

4034
02:47:05,750 --> 02:47:03,920
end up

4035
02:47:07,750 --> 02:47:05,760
wanting to stay on you're going to end

4036
02:47:09,190 --> 02:47:07,760
up wanting to keep talking and that'll

4037
02:47:11,590 --> 02:47:09,200
be fine well jimmy you know i can only

4038
02:47:13,910 --> 02:47:11,600
talk for an hour okay all right that's

4039
02:47:15,190 --> 02:47:13,920
fine and that hour turns into two and a

4040
02:47:16,389 --> 02:47:15,200
half hours

4041
02:47:19,030 --> 02:47:16,399
because

4042
02:47:20,710 --> 02:47:19,040
they're comfortable and and it's okay

4043
02:47:22,469 --> 02:47:20,720
and they want to open up

4044
02:47:24,150 --> 02:47:22,479
i want to learn just like you do go

4045
02:47:25,510 --> 02:47:24,160
ahead i'm sorry yeah well yeah i'm just

4046
02:47:27,349 --> 02:47:25,520
saying the same thing happened with

4047
02:47:29,670 --> 02:47:27,359
travis walton when you had him on i also

4048
02:47:31,190 --> 02:47:29,680
met travis walton at one of these

4049
02:47:33,670 --> 02:47:31,200
speaking engagements because i used to

4050
02:47:35,349 --> 02:47:33,680
be in charge of the speaker's room and i

4051
02:47:37,349 --> 02:47:35,359
waited till no one was around and i

4052
02:47:39,349 --> 02:47:37,359
approached him and he happens to be the

4053
02:47:41,429 --> 02:47:39,359
same age as me and ironically born

4054
02:47:43,990 --> 02:47:41,439
exactly a month on the same day before

4055
02:47:45,590 --> 02:47:44,000
me so he's a month older than me and he

4056
02:47:48,469 --> 02:47:45,600
i used to kind of look like the guy too

4057
02:47:50,550 --> 02:47:48,479
when he had a mustache and i didn't

4058
02:47:51,910 --> 02:47:50,560
think at the time that he was that

4059
02:47:54,550 --> 02:47:51,920
articulate

4060
02:47:56,710 --> 02:47:54,560
or that bright to make up this story

4061
02:47:58,389 --> 02:47:56,720
right well i asked i asked him i said

4062
02:48:00,150 --> 02:47:58,399
have you ever been hypnotized because i

4063
02:48:02,710 --> 02:48:00,160
said i'm new to all this again this was

4064
02:48:04,790 --> 02:48:02,720
back in the 90s and he got very freaked

4065
02:48:06,150 --> 02:48:04,800
out i think genuinely and he said that's

4066
02:48:07,830 --> 02:48:06,160
a box

4067
02:48:09,590 --> 02:48:07,840
he said that i put over there in the

4068
02:48:11,269 --> 02:48:09,600
corner and he said i tried it once and

4069
02:48:13,750 --> 02:48:11,279
it freaked me out too much

4070
02:48:15,349 --> 02:48:13,760
well hearing him on your show recently

4071
02:48:16,630 --> 02:48:15,359
it sounds like he's become much more

4072
02:48:19,190 --> 02:48:16,640
articulate

4073
02:48:21,830 --> 02:48:19,200
and he's he's added to the book that he

4074
02:48:24,150 --> 02:48:21,840
wrote he's republished it and it makes

4075
02:48:26,630 --> 02:48:24,160
him even more believable to me because

4076
02:48:28,710 --> 02:48:26,640
he seems to come out with things that

4077
02:48:30,870 --> 02:48:28,720
are genuine and when he was on your show

4078
02:48:32,790 --> 02:48:30,880
he said gee this is the first time i've

4079
02:48:35,030 --> 02:48:32,800
been on a show or i don't wasn't asked

4080
02:48:36,550 --> 02:48:35,040
to recount the story about how they

4081
02:48:38,870 --> 02:48:36,560
abducted me what did they look like and

4082
02:48:41,269 --> 02:48:38,880
did they stick needles in me right

4083
02:48:43,670 --> 02:48:41,279
and and and and you're exact do you know

4084
02:48:46,230 --> 02:48:43,680
that's exactly right and the thing the

4085
02:48:49,510 --> 02:48:46,240
thing is about travis

4086
02:48:50,950 --> 02:48:49,520
is that you have to

4087
02:48:53,429 --> 02:48:50,960
he's one of the smartest people you

4088
02:48:55,590 --> 02:48:53,439
could ever meet he's and and you hit the

4089
02:48:59,349 --> 02:48:55,600
nail on the head articulate you wouldn't

4090
02:49:02,469 --> 02:48:59,359
think that you know a lumberjack

4091
02:49:05,190 --> 02:49:02,479
you know from northern arizona

4092
02:49:07,110 --> 02:49:05,200
um carries himself like that he's a very

4093
02:49:10,790 --> 02:49:07,120
smart

4094
02:49:12,630 --> 02:49:10,800
gentleman and and he has and

4095
02:49:15,030 --> 02:49:12,640
you know under the microscope for so

4096
02:49:17,110 --> 02:49:15,040
long and has been asked

4097
02:49:19,670 --> 02:49:17,120
and drilled you know for so long that

4098
02:49:22,870 --> 02:49:19,680
he's protective but when he came on this

4099
02:49:24,389 --> 02:49:22,880
show um i i told him we don't have to

4100
02:49:25,990 --> 02:49:24,399
talk about anything let's don't talk

4101
02:49:26,870 --> 02:49:26,000
about anything let's just let's just

4102
02:49:29,910 --> 02:49:26,880
talk

4103
02:49:31,590 --> 02:49:29,920
and he he had told me you know nobody's

4104
02:49:34,230 --> 02:49:31,600
ever treated me like that

4105
02:49:35,830 --> 02:49:34,240
and i and i totally appreciated uh him

4106
02:49:39,030 --> 02:49:35,840
coming on and saying those things that

4107
02:49:40,870 --> 02:49:39,040
he did for me but uh hey dino thank you

4108
02:49:42,230 --> 02:49:40,880
i've got i've got another call

4109
02:49:43,990 --> 02:49:42,240
same thing with what you just said

4110
02:49:46,309 --> 02:49:44,000
tonight though is just

4111
02:49:47,990 --> 02:49:46,319
i didn't know about that island and and

4112
02:49:50,550 --> 02:49:48,000
the fact that that adds a whole new

4113
02:49:52,630 --> 02:49:50,560
dimension to this airplane disappearance

4114
02:49:54,389 --> 02:49:52,640
thank you dino and i'll talk to you next

4115
02:49:57,110 --> 02:49:54,399
week you got it

4116
02:49:57,120 --> 02:50:02,230
hi welcome to the show who's calling

4117
02:50:07,349 --> 02:50:04,870
welcome to the show who's calling

4118
02:50:09,910 --> 02:50:07,359
hi this is robert hi robert how are you

4119
02:50:14,070 --> 02:50:09,920
sir oh good how are you

4120
02:50:19,190 --> 02:50:16,230
uh what what's shaking you know about

4121
02:50:20,630 --> 02:50:19,200
that uh that flight the um malaysian air

4122
02:50:23,110 --> 02:50:20,640
flight yep

4123
02:50:26,309 --> 02:50:23,120
after i had seen some you know i've

4124
02:50:28,790 --> 02:50:26,319
actually watched a lot of uh videos on

4125
02:50:29,990 --> 02:50:28,800
the aircraft investigation you remember

4126
02:50:32,469 --> 02:50:30,000
that series

4127
02:50:33,990 --> 02:50:32,479
yep they had it on like you know the

4128
02:50:37,269 --> 02:50:34,000
discovery channel or something i think

4129
02:50:40,309 --> 02:50:37,279
at the time anyhow i did see a photo of

4130
02:50:42,950 --> 02:50:40,319
that egyptian heir that they had a fire

4131
02:50:44,389 --> 02:50:42,960
in the cockpit right

4132
02:50:46,469 --> 02:50:44,399
you know and

4133
02:50:48,830 --> 02:50:46,479
if you ever saw that picture you would

4134
02:50:51,429 --> 02:50:48,840
see that the damage was

4135
02:50:53,510 --> 02:50:51,439
extensive it even burned through the

4136
02:50:56,150 --> 02:50:53,520
fuselage so there would have been

4137
02:50:57,910 --> 02:50:56,160
decompression right if that plane had

4138
02:51:00,630 --> 02:50:57,920
been in the air at the time of course it

4139
02:51:03,030 --> 02:51:00,640
was on the ground so right you know they

4140
02:51:04,630 --> 02:51:03,040
could uh no one was killed in the plane

4141
02:51:05,990 --> 02:51:04,640
you know they handled the situation

4142
02:51:08,389 --> 02:51:06,000
right there

4143
02:51:10,230 --> 02:51:08,399
so i was thinking that

4144
02:51:11,910 --> 02:51:10,240
this seems like a real

4145
02:51:13,750 --> 02:51:11,920
possibility to me

4146
02:51:15,750 --> 02:51:13,760
because i i've been thinking about it

4147
02:51:17,670 --> 02:51:15,760
for quite a while as to

4148
02:51:19,269 --> 02:51:17,680
what would allow you know account for

4149
02:51:20,870 --> 02:51:19,279
all these strange things you know the

4150
02:51:22,150 --> 02:51:20,880
drop in altitude and

4151
02:51:24,550 --> 02:51:22,160
and uh

4152
02:51:27,590 --> 02:51:24,560
turning off different electronic devices

4153
02:51:29,830 --> 02:51:27,600
and well you know i i'll say this i'll

4154
02:51:31,910 --> 02:51:29,840
say this um

4155
02:51:33,429 --> 02:51:31,920
you you bring up a really good point and

4156
02:51:36,630 --> 02:51:33,439
and i and

4157
02:51:38,950 --> 02:51:36,640
there was a flight and i believe it was

4158
02:51:41,510 --> 02:51:38,960
it was in the northeast and it was

4159
02:51:44,070 --> 02:51:41,520
coming into i want to say

4160
02:51:46,150 --> 02:51:44,080
uh it was uh just took off from it was

4161
02:51:48,630 --> 02:51:46,160
landing in canada or just took off from

4162
02:51:51,030 --> 02:51:48,640
canada i think it was swiss air

4163
02:51:52,150 --> 02:51:51,040
and they they had the fire in the

4164
02:51:53,910 --> 02:51:52,160
cockpit

4165
02:51:56,790 --> 02:51:53,920
and they had to

4166
02:51:59,429 --> 02:51:56,800
fly out over the water

4167
02:52:01,269 --> 02:51:59,439
and dump their fuel before they came

4168
02:52:02,790 --> 02:52:01,279
back and tried to make a landing because

4169
02:52:03,830 --> 02:52:02,800
when you take off and you're full of

4170
02:52:06,309 --> 02:52:03,840
fuel

4171
02:52:08,150 --> 02:52:06,319
that's one thing but when you land with

4172
02:52:10,309 --> 02:52:08,160
full tanks yeah yeah it's a lot of

4173
02:52:12,469 --> 02:52:10,319
weight on the plane not only that so

4174
02:52:14,230 --> 02:52:12,479
they there's not the runway's not long

4175
02:52:17,030 --> 02:52:14,240
enough that's the first thing second you

4176
02:52:19,190 --> 02:52:17,040
have a big explosion potentially so they

4177
02:52:21,750 --> 02:52:19,200
went out and that just in a couple of

4178
02:52:24,790 --> 02:52:21,760
minutes that they went out to go

4179
02:52:26,870 --> 02:52:24,800
and start to dump their fuel the

4180
02:52:28,550 --> 02:52:26,880
the cockpit just took off in flames and

4181
02:52:31,990 --> 02:52:28,560
it was just a small you know they

4182
02:52:34,230 --> 02:52:32,000
smelled some smoke and it went from that

4183
02:52:36,230 --> 02:52:34,240
to that thing just crashed in the water

4184
02:52:38,950 --> 02:52:36,240
immediately i mean it just went up in

4185
02:52:40,870 --> 02:52:38,960
flames so yeah when and you know how it

4186
02:52:44,710 --> 02:52:40,880
is when you have an electrical fire in a

4187
02:52:49,110 --> 02:52:46,389
yeah yeah yeah that car is going up in

4188
02:52:51,030 --> 02:52:49,120
smoke in a couple of seconds and you can

4189
02:52:52,389 --> 02:52:51,040
you're in a box you know you need to get

4190
02:52:54,710 --> 02:52:52,399
out that's right

4191
02:52:57,110 --> 02:52:54,720
and you can't stop it you cannot you can

4192
02:52:59,510 --> 02:52:57,120
throw all the water on it you want but

4193
02:53:02,150 --> 02:52:59,520
it's not going to stop it so i i'm i'm

4194
02:53:04,469 --> 02:53:02,160
hip to that and i understand and like i

4195
02:53:06,070 --> 02:53:04,479
said uh somebody can

4196
02:53:08,710 --> 02:53:06,080
you know shoot us an email and correct

4197
02:53:11,030 --> 02:53:08,720
me on what but i believe it was a swiss

4198
02:53:13,349 --> 02:53:11,040
flight out of canada and

4199
02:53:16,710 --> 02:53:13,359
and that's an example of how they went

4200
02:53:18,870 --> 02:53:16,720
they radioed the tower we got an issue

4201
02:53:20,790 --> 02:53:18,880
to a couple of minutes later that plane

4202
02:53:24,070 --> 02:53:20,800
was crashed

4203
02:53:26,870 --> 02:53:24,080
and and and when an electrical fire

4204
02:53:29,269 --> 02:53:26,880
wants to take off uh sure absolutely you

4205
02:53:31,510 --> 02:53:29,279
can't stop it and and i could see the

4206
02:53:33,590 --> 02:53:31,520
cockpit filling up with smoke but the

4207
02:53:35,990 --> 02:53:33,600
thing is with this the only the only

4208
02:53:36,830 --> 02:53:36,000
issue that i have is that it flew for

4209
02:53:39,190 --> 02:53:36,840
for

4210
02:53:40,389 --> 02:53:39,200
hours you know and that's that's the

4211
02:53:42,550 --> 02:53:40,399
only thing

4212
02:53:45,269 --> 02:53:42,560
and flying well you know those uh the

4213
02:53:47,269 --> 02:53:45,279
autopilot systems are separate

4214
02:53:49,990 --> 02:53:47,279
you know there's actually a couple of

4215
02:53:54,070 --> 02:53:50,000
backups with those systems and they can

4216
02:53:57,349 --> 02:53:54,080
function without you know any cockpit

4217
02:53:58,710 --> 02:53:57,359
cockpit intervention for you know

4218
02:54:01,269 --> 02:53:58,720
they're going to do whatever they have

4219
02:54:02,469 --> 02:54:01,279
to do whatever's programmed into them so

4220
02:54:04,830 --> 02:54:02,479
well they you know that's a good

4221
02:54:08,550 --> 02:54:04,840
question and does that mean that the

4222
02:54:10,950 --> 02:54:08,560
hydraulics stay stable and that the

4223
02:54:12,630 --> 02:54:10,960
the the gyroscopes and everything that

4224
02:54:15,269 --> 02:54:12,640
keep the level flight

4225
02:54:17,510 --> 02:54:15,279
i know that some of it is uh independent

4226
02:54:20,790 --> 02:54:17,520
and some of it is redundant but in the

4227
02:54:22,230 --> 02:54:20,800
case of a total catastrophic meltdown in

4228
02:54:25,349 --> 02:54:22,240
the cockpit

4229
02:54:27,670 --> 02:54:25,359
is the plane able to stay level

4230
02:54:29,190 --> 02:54:27,680
and fly straight

4231
02:54:30,550 --> 02:54:29,200
you know leveling straight well

4232
02:54:32,550 --> 02:54:30,560
especially with the weather you know

4233
02:54:35,830 --> 02:54:32,560
that's really going to have a really big

4234
02:54:36,630 --> 02:54:35,840
impact on on its you know flyability i

4235
02:54:39,269 --> 02:54:36,640
guess

4236
02:54:41,269 --> 02:54:39,279
so what do you um do you think uh it's

4237
02:54:43,190 --> 02:54:41,279
possible that the plane was you know

4238
02:54:45,349 --> 02:54:43,200
shot down

4239
02:54:47,429 --> 02:54:45,359
well i you know i had never really got

4240
02:54:49,830 --> 02:54:47,439
that feeling personally i kind of

4241
02:54:50,550 --> 02:54:49,840
thought that it was um

4242
02:54:52,550 --> 02:54:50,560
that

4243
02:54:54,710 --> 02:54:52,560
people on board might have actually

4244
02:54:56,469 --> 02:54:54,720
suffocated before the plane actually

4245
02:54:58,309 --> 02:54:56,479
touched down in the water and it may

4246
02:54:59,429 --> 02:54:58,319
have just been on autopilot the whole

4247
02:55:01,030 --> 02:54:59,439
way

4248
02:55:02,630 --> 02:55:01,040
uh that's that's kind of what i was

4249
02:55:04,550 --> 02:55:02,640
thinking and it might not have even

4250
02:55:07,110 --> 02:55:04,560
broken up because

4251
02:55:09,190 --> 02:55:07,120
you know it it's supposed to go down to

4252
02:55:10,870 --> 02:55:09,200
1500 feet or something like that

4253
02:55:13,110 --> 02:55:10,880
immediately when when there's a

4254
02:55:14,550 --> 02:55:13,120
decompression right and that's part of

4255
02:55:16,550 --> 02:55:14,560
the autopilot

4256
02:55:19,030 --> 02:55:16,560
you know system right so you can get

4257
02:55:21,429 --> 02:55:19,040
oxygen back into the airplane the oxygen

4258
02:55:23,429 --> 02:55:21,439
exactly the oxygen and

4259
02:55:24,469 --> 02:55:23,439
the other thing you do is you shut down

4260
02:55:26,309 --> 02:55:24,479
everything

4261
02:55:27,990 --> 02:55:26,319
that where the electricity is going to

4262
02:55:29,990 --> 02:55:28,000
go if you have an electrical fire you

4263
02:55:33,269 --> 02:55:30,000
shut down everything that's running on

4264
02:55:34,950 --> 02:55:33,279
electricity so that's well is the only

4265
02:55:37,910 --> 02:55:34,960
common the first thing that's kind of

4266
02:55:39,670 --> 02:55:37,920
like the very first aid you know so well

4267
02:55:42,389 --> 02:55:39,680
the way that i look at it is this the

4268
02:55:44,469 --> 02:55:42,399
lesson learned from 911

4269
02:55:47,110 --> 02:55:44,479
is if we've got a stray airplane up

4270
02:55:49,910 --> 02:55:47,120
there there's bad intentions going on

4271
02:55:53,030 --> 02:55:49,920
and if the pilots weren't answering back

4272
02:55:54,710 --> 02:55:53,040
and the plane is on its own course

4273
02:55:56,870 --> 02:55:54,720
we're going to go out and take it out i

4274
02:55:58,710 --> 02:55:56,880
mean that's just i'm just thinking

4275
02:56:00,630 --> 02:55:58,720
it seems like that i mean i i wouldn't

4276
02:56:02,630 --> 02:56:00,640
put it past this for a second and

4277
02:56:05,190 --> 02:56:02,640
knowing that that that military base is

4278
02:56:08,230 --> 02:56:05,200
down there you know that they have radar

4279
02:56:10,830 --> 02:56:08,240
they don't need a transponder no they

4280
02:56:13,190 --> 02:56:10,840
don't you just fine no they don't

4281
02:56:16,150 --> 02:56:13,200
exactly exactly

4282
02:56:17,110 --> 02:56:16,160
between us and and uh australia you know

4283
02:56:19,670 --> 02:56:17,120
we've got

4284
02:56:21,990 --> 02:56:19,680
the technology we've had it since

4285
02:56:23,269 --> 02:56:22,000
you know world war ii basically

4286
02:56:25,670 --> 02:56:23,279
so

4287
02:56:28,150 --> 02:56:25,680
no there's no doubt we have the means

4288
02:56:30,070 --> 02:56:28,160
and to think that anything else is

4289
02:56:32,150 --> 02:56:30,080
well you know what the good news is

4290
02:56:34,150 --> 02:56:32,160
johnny we're at the end of the show so

4291
02:56:36,150 --> 02:56:34,160
you get to

4292
02:56:37,910 --> 02:56:36,160
write out the music with us and i'll

4293
02:56:39,269 --> 02:56:37,920
read the credits and then at the end of

4294
02:56:41,590 --> 02:56:39,279
everything you can say good night to

4295
02:56:43,830 --> 02:56:41,600
everybody how's that awesome okay man

4296
02:56:46,630 --> 02:56:43,840
stay say stay on the air say i'm gonna

4297
02:56:49,269 --> 02:56:46,640
roll the music right now and uh and you

4298
02:56:51,510 --> 02:56:49,279
can say goodnight to everybody

4299
02:56:53,110 --> 02:56:51,520
all right friday night right here fade

4300
02:56:55,590 --> 02:56:53,120
to black on the dark matter radio

4301
02:56:57,910 --> 02:56:55,600
network i am your host jimmy church oh

4302
02:56:59,830 --> 02:56:57,920
you know what hey are you still with us

4303
02:57:05,750 --> 02:56:59,840
yep oh you know what i can't run the

4304
02:57:11,110 --> 02:57:08,070
all right hey johnny thank you very much

4305
02:57:12,950 --> 02:57:11,120
and uh thank you good night and have a

4306
02:57:17,910 --> 02:57:12,960
good everybody yeah good night and have

4307
02:57:21,349 --> 02:57:20,389
all right fade to black

4308
02:57:23,750 --> 02:57:21,359
now

4309
02:57:27,110 --> 02:57:23,760
i can run the music

4310
02:57:28,710 --> 02:57:27,120
all right fade to black

4311
02:57:31,030 --> 02:57:28,720
i'm your host jimmy church thank you

4312
02:57:32,870 --> 02:57:31,040
annie jacobson

4313
02:57:33,990 --> 02:57:32,880
it was a great time thanks to all the

4314
02:57:36,710 --> 02:57:34,000
callers

4315
02:57:38,389 --> 02:57:36,720
stay tuned coming up next is michio kaku

4316
02:57:40,550 --> 02:57:38,399
followed by after dark with your host

4317
02:57:42,389 --> 02:57:40,560
brian alvarez

4318
02:57:44,469 --> 02:57:42,399
after dark live special thanks to keith

4319
02:57:46,309 --> 02:57:44,479
rowland and art bell

4320
02:57:48,550 --> 02:57:46,319
beta black's executive producers rita

4321
02:57:51,190 --> 02:57:48,560
kamarian the show is produced by hill j

4322
02:57:53,590 --> 02:57:51,200
palm and mark d kovar

4323
02:57:55,349 --> 02:57:53,600
the announcers are steve harder and mark

4324
02:57:56,870 --> 02:57:55,359
d kovar

4325
02:57:58,950 --> 02:57:56,880
music is by doug aldrich you are

4326
02:58:01,830 --> 02:57:58,960
listening to him right now

4327
02:58:04,150 --> 02:58:01,840
fade to black it's produced by kj cr for

4328
02:58:05,510 --> 02:58:04,160
the dark matter radio network have a

4329
02:58:06,870 --> 02:58:05,520
great weekend everybody i'm your host

4330
02:58:08,230 --> 02:58:06,880
jimmy church

4331
02:58:22,550 --> 02:58:08,240
we'll see you

4332
02:58:22,560 --> 02:58:44,150
so